05-23-2005, 06:52 PM | #241 | |
The Intermittent One
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little red books aside, it happens to be the proven factors for marriage hence tax benefits (in UK) for married couples, and so on. i refer the honourable gentleman to the response given in the above post from lotesse |
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05-23-2005, 06:53 PM | #242 |
An enigma in a conundrum
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to quote Poo "we is not them"
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Vizzini: "HE DIDN'T FALL?! INCONCEIVABLE!!" Inigo: "You keep using that word. I do not think it means what you think it means." |
05-23-2005, 06:55 PM | #243 |
An enigma in a conundrum
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[QUOTE=Last Child of Ungoliant]psst! yer tags are showing!
yeah I couldn't get rid of them so I re did the post I saw your reply above but differed in my interpretation thats all.
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Vizzini: "HE DIDN'T FALL?! INCONCEIVABLE!!" Inigo: "You keep using that word. I do not think it means what you think it means." |
05-23-2005, 06:55 PM | #244 | |
The Intermittent One
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and the gold medal for question evading goes to.... |
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05-23-2005, 06:56 PM | #245 | |
Half-Elven Princess of Rabbit Trails and Harp-Wielding Administrator (beware the Rubber Chicken of Doom!)
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I think marriage exists because God established it as a blessing for a man and a woman, as a foundational structure of the family and society in accordance with our nature and for our good, and as a picture of the love and closeness that God desires with people (in the Bible, marriage is used as a picture of this). Even secular studies show that the best possible thing for children is to have a mother and father in a committed relationship. And secular studies also show that married people are healthier than singles. Marriage sure seems to be something that's good for us - we're designed for it, IMO. I don't see how marriage promotes your #2, Chrys - seems like people are gonna have kids whether they're married or not! And as for your #3 - if the current system works well, why not perpetuate it? IMO, that reflects the common error of change necessarily equals good, which is clearly untrue.
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. I should be doing the laundry, but this is MUCH more fun! Ñá ë?* óú éä ïöü Öñ É Þ ð ß ® ç Ã¥ â„¢ æ ♪ ?* "How lovely are Thy dwelling places, O Lord of hosts! ... For a day in Thy courts is better than a thousand outside." (from Psalm 84) * * * God rocks! Entmoot : Veni, vidi, velcro - I came, I saw, I got hooked! Ego numquam pronunciare mendacium, sed ego sum homo indomitus! Run the earth and watch the sky ... Auta i lómë! Aurë entuluva! Last edited by RÃan : 05-23-2005 at 06:58 PM. |
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05-23-2005, 07:01 PM | #246 | |||||
The Intermittent One
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05-23-2005, 07:02 PM | #247 | |
An enigma in a conundrum
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I don't get your using "sexualist" as a rational argument, but then, hey, we are coming from different cultures ourselves. So we can agree to disagree, yes?
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Vizzini: "HE DIDN'T FALL?! INCONCEIVABLE!!" Inigo: "You keep using that word. I do not think it means what you think it means." |
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05-23-2005, 07:04 PM | #248 |
An enigma in a conundrum
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[QUOTE=RÃ*an]I beg to disagree
I think marriage exists because God established it as a blessing for a man and a woman, Actually marriage was created by The Church, people "coupled" and lived together in various cultures before TC came up with the sacrament of marriage.
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Vizzini: "HE DIDN'T FALL?! INCONCEIVABLE!!" Inigo: "You keep using that word. I do not think it means what you think it means." |
05-23-2005, 07:05 PM | #249 |
The Intermittent One
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NO!! i will NOT agree on this matter [j/k]
of course uk and usa are two of the most centrally aligned cultures, whilst at the same time being so ultimately diametrically opposed, which in itself creates a pardoxical parallax! |
05-23-2005, 07:08 PM | #250 |
An enigma in a conundrum
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I thought you were against the use of large words oh, maybe I'm confused
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Vizzini: "HE DIDN'T FALL?! INCONCEIVABLE!!" Inigo: "You keep using that word. I do not think it means what you think it means." |
05-23-2005, 07:14 PM | #251 | |
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Perhaps the NAME was created by the church, but not the concept. However, the concept was, IMO, created by the founder of the church...
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. I should be doing the laundry, but this is MUCH more fun! Ñá ë?* óú éä ïöü Öñ É Þ ð ß ® ç Ã¥ â„¢ æ ♪ ?* "How lovely are Thy dwelling places, O Lord of hosts! ... For a day in Thy courts is better than a thousand outside." (from Psalm 84) * * * God rocks! Entmoot : Veni, vidi, velcro - I came, I saw, I got hooked! Ego numquam pronunciare mendacium, sed ego sum homo indomitus! Run the earth and watch the sky ... Auta i lómë! Aurë entuluva! |
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05-23-2005, 07:16 PM | #252 | |
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05-23-2005, 07:23 PM | #253 |
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But if the concept existed before the name given by TC then the current definition is arbitrary by historical standards. As we are supposed to be a nation of laws, the law should be kept and if necessary a new name given for unions other than the current definition of marriage. IMO
there was marriage under Druidic law and that certainly was pre-christian
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Vizzini: "HE DIDN'T FALL?! INCONCEIVABLE!!" Inigo: "You keep using that word. I do not think it means what you think it means." Last edited by Spock : 05-23-2005 at 07:27 PM. Reason: signing off for the night...... |
05-23-2005, 07:37 PM | #254 |
of the House of Fëanor
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One definition of marriage is the entering into of a contract between two people, wherein they each pledge to the other to be allied AS ONE through thick and thin, etc., it is a legally binding contract which may not be broken without due consequence. But the LAW sanctions the contract, the law AND the church; it is a contract made binding by outside forces. It's as if the two people to be joined cannot bring themselves respectively to trust the other, outright, without bringing in a powerful third party to "O.K." and make binding said contract.
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05-23-2005, 07:39 PM | #255 | |
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05-23-2005, 08:23 PM | #256 | ||
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Now my society, in its wisdom, recognizes the value of marriage, and has granted privileges to those that enter into it, and made it somewhat difficult to get out of, traditionally to protect women and children. But to me, that's secondary, or even irrelevant. (and one reason that marriage laws were codified, at least in Christianity (the Old Testament), was to protect women. Many pagan cultures had a very low view of women; one of the reasons that I'm impressed with the timelessness of the Bible is that it goes against the culture of the times in regard to women. The OT divorce laws protected women against a common practice of divorce for any reason whatsoever, which in those times could really devastate a woman.)
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. I should be doing the laundry, but this is MUCH more fun! Ñá ë?* óú éä ïöü Öñ É Þ ð ß ® ç Ã¥ â„¢ æ ♪ ?* "How lovely are Thy dwelling places, O Lord of hosts! ... For a day in Thy courts is better than a thousand outside." (from Psalm 84) * * * God rocks! Entmoot : Veni, vidi, velcro - I came, I saw, I got hooked! Ego numquam pronunciare mendacium, sed ego sum homo indomitus! Run the earth and watch the sky ... Auta i lómë! Aurë entuluva! |
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05-23-2005, 10:50 PM | #257 | |
Elven Warrior
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1. on one hand marriage existed well before the Jews invented the idea of "one god" 2. on the other hand there is no such thing as "one marriage throughout time and space". Many different institutions have been called marriage Last edited by The Wizard from Milan : 05-23-2005 at 10:52 PM. |
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05-24-2005, 12:20 AM | #258 |
An enigma in a conundrum
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But marriage IS as it always has been and the definition should not be changed merely to make certain people feel more accepted. The insurance and benefits people need to accept civil union as do those seeking them.
and while many institutions have been around, they all had the same arranged two sex concept.
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Vizzini: "HE DIDN'T FALL?! INCONCEIVABLE!!" Inigo: "You keep using that word. I do not think it means what you think it means." Last edited by Spock : 05-24-2005 at 12:22 AM. |
05-24-2005, 05:37 AM | #259 | |
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05-24-2005, 08:39 AM | #260 | ||
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Not to mention that social control by the ruling classes (whoever you think they are) would be a lot easier if there were legal sanctions against people who don't get married, who break their marriage vows, who have children outside marriage etc. There is no such legal stigma and no social one any more. How exactly are the ruling classes forcing people to get married? Quote:
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And all the time the waves, the waves, the waves Chase, intersect and flatten on the sand As they have done for centuries, as they will For centuries to come, when not a soul Is left to picnic on the blazing rocks, When England is not England, when mankind Has blown himself to pieces. Still the sea, Consolingly disastrous, will return While the strange starfish, hugely magnified, Waits in the jewelled basin of a pool. |
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