10-31-2002, 01:51 PM | #241 |
im quite stupid
Join Date: Feb 2002
Location: Cockermouth
Posts: 2,058
|
cool we are bashing religion. whos more evil someone that comits evil or someone that allows evil to be commited.
In my opinion relgion should not be taught at all in schools (i know all are covred in rs) i am tallking about in assemblys where they go on about jesus and stuff poluting the minds of people. schools should teach facts not made up rubbish. Relgion is root of all evil and those that follow it are servely misguided and many unwittingly comit many an evil
__________________
Yeah god hes ok but i would rather be judged by a sheep than that idiot |
10-31-2002, 05:16 PM | #242 | |||||
Elf Lord
Join Date: Dec 2000
Location: Fountain Valley, CA
Posts: 6,343
|
One note: I made a couple writing errors in my previous post, like when I said that it is mercy to send someone to hell. That was a big goof up error, I meant isn't. But God had already offered his mercy, and it was rejected. Therefore it is justice.
Quote:
Quote:
Quote:
That's the Golden Rule, a part of the Bible. Do unto others as you'd have them do unto you. Quote:
Quote:
|
|||||
10-31-2002, 05:21 PM | #243 | |
Elf Lord
Join Date: Dec 2000
Location: Fountain Valley, CA
Posts: 6,343
|
Quote:
And when you pray that God will reveal himself to you, that is also a prayer that you can know that God wants to answer, because he has claimed to want a relationship with every human being. Therefore this prayer will be answered. You can set the method, but your heart needs to be aimed toward discovering him, not having things done for you. Last edited by Lief Erikson : 10-31-2002 at 05:28 PM. |
|
10-31-2002, 05:46 PM | #244 | |
Half-Elven Princess of Rabbit Trails and Harp-Wielding Administrator (beware the Rubber Chicken of Doom!)
Join Date: Sep 2002
Location: Not where I want to be ...
Posts: 15,254
|
Quote:
I think that you have rather a vending-machine mentality of prayer here (and I sure hope that you know, Lizra, that I mean absolutely no offense to you - I am just using that illustration because I think it really points out the full implications of your statement - "so you ask, and whatever happens happens.") So I think that if you really think about what you're saying, it really is something like this: "insert prayer in slot, push button, answer that I requested comes out at the bottom" (and if it doesn't, then kick the machine!) Well, let me ask you this: if your cute little boy asked you "mommy, could I please go and play on the freeway? I REEEELY want to, it looks like so much fun!", what would you say? You, as an adult, know SO much more than he does! You would lovingly say "NO". Christians believe that God is all-knowing, and thus He can correctly and in our best interests answer a prayer either yes, no, or wait a while, it's not the right time yet. And "getting an answer" is only a small part of the purpose of prayer! Again, as both Lief and I have posted, one aspect of Christianity is that it is relational - we are also reminded to be thankful in our prayers, for we so easily forget all of our many blessings, and we are also told to pray for others. And sometimes, as I'm just starting to see, I think God's answer is "hang in there and keep praying ... that's not quite the question that I want you to ask me ... I have a much bigger blessing that I would rather give you!" See, prayer is also a process - as we spend time in prayer, we become more Christlike, and we will, by ourselves, see how some of our prayers in the past were, by God's great mercy and grace, answered with a "no". I hope that helps - let me know if I can clarify.
__________________
. I should be doing the laundry, but this is MUCH more fun! Ñá ë?* óú éä ïöü Öñ É Þ ð ß ® ç å ™ æ ♪ ?* "How lovely are Thy dwelling places, O Lord of hosts! ... For a day in Thy courts is better than a thousand outside." (from Psalm 84) * * * God rocks! Entmoot : Veni, vidi, velcro - I came, I saw, I got hooked! Ego numquam pronunciare mendacium, sed ego sum homo indomitus! Run the earth and watch the sky ... Auta i lómë! Aurë entuluva! Last edited by Rían : 10-31-2002 at 05:48 PM. |
|
10-31-2002, 05:52 PM | #245 | |
Elf Lord
Join Date: Jan 2002
Location: Slow down and I sail on the river, slow down and I walk to the hill
Posts: 2,389
|
Quote:
You have to remember, God is not the only 'being', 'spirit', 'whathaveyou' on the plane outside of Earth. Also, I'm in agreement with Rian on the 'vending machine' prayer approach. God answers prayers when they're meant to be answered, which is not necessarily when we want them. Also, he may answer them, but not in the way we expect (or in a way that we even notice).
__________________
“The whole problem with the world is that fools and fanatics are always so certain of themselves, but wiser people so full of doubts.” –Bertrand Russell Last edited by Starr Polish : 10-31-2002 at 05:54 PM. |
|
10-31-2002, 05:59 PM | #246 |
Half-Elven Princess of Rabbit Trails and Harp-Wielding Administrator (beware the Rubber Chicken of Doom!)
Join Date: Sep 2002
Location: Not where I want to be ...
Posts: 15,254
|
Sween, I haven't addressed your posts because the way I read it, you're not really wanting to discuss things, because you're really throwing out over-generalizations, don't you think? Wouldn't you agree, for example, that there are evil people that are not "religious"? I imagine that you've been really hurt by "religious" people, and I'm so sorry. But God is bigger than "religious" people, and if you truly and sincerely seek Him for your answers, He will give them to you, although they may not quite be what you would like! However, they are true and in your best interests. And God can use all things, even the evil ones that He has allowed for this present time, for our good and the good of others. For example, I imagine that you are a very compassionate person, because you have been hurt. (But I am getting ahead of myself - if you're interested, I am going to address the pain issue shortly). Try checking out the "Did Iluvatar make Melkor evil" thread in Sil or ME - we are discussing some related issues there that you might find interesting. If you have a specific question for me (without the overgeneralizations, please ), then let me know, and I'll put it in my queue I'm rather slow, though - very busy with small kids - so you'll have to be patient.
__________________
. I should be doing the laundry, but this is MUCH more fun! Ñá ë?* óú éä ïöü Öñ É Þ ð ß ® ç å ™ æ ♪ ?* "How lovely are Thy dwelling places, O Lord of hosts! ... For a day in Thy courts is better than a thousand outside." (from Psalm 84) * * * God rocks! Entmoot : Veni, vidi, velcro - I came, I saw, I got hooked! Ego numquam pronunciare mendacium, sed ego sum homo indomitus! Run the earth and watch the sky ... Auta i lómë! Aurë entuluva! |
10-31-2002, 06:03 PM | #247 | |
Half-Elven Princess of Rabbit Trails and Harp-Wielding Administrator (beware the Rubber Chicken of Doom!)
Join Date: Sep 2002
Location: Not where I want to be ...
Posts: 15,254
|
Quote:
What I was trying to address was Lizra's belief that Christian prayer meant asking and then getting exactly what you asked for, and if it didn't work, then either prayer is worthless or God is not there or not powerful. That is most definitely NOT what Christian prayer is about.
__________________
. I should be doing the laundry, but this is MUCH more fun! Ñá ë?* óú éä ïöü Öñ É Þ ð ß ® ç å ™ æ ♪ ?* "How lovely are Thy dwelling places, O Lord of hosts! ... For a day in Thy courts is better than a thousand outside." (from Psalm 84) * * * God rocks! Entmoot : Veni, vidi, velcro - I came, I saw, I got hooked! Ego numquam pronunciare mendacium, sed ego sum homo indomitus! Run the earth and watch the sky ... Auta i lómë! Aurë entuluva! |
|
10-31-2002, 06:09 PM | #248 |
Elf Lord
Join Date: Dec 2000
Location: Fountain Valley, CA
Posts: 6,343
|
Yes, and Starr Polish, you don't have to believe in God to pray that he will reveal himself if he exists. God is willing to answer that one, and he is waiting for each person to ask it. That's the point I'm trying to emphasize, for he will reveal himself to the person who requests to come to know him.
Last edited by Lief Erikson : 10-31-2002 at 06:16 PM. |
10-31-2002, 06:13 PM | #249 |
Half-Elven Princess of Rabbit Trails and Harp-Wielding Administrator (beware the Rubber Chicken of Doom!)
Join Date: Sep 2002
Location: Not where I want to be ...
Posts: 15,254
|
whoops - I read thru your post too quickly, Starr, and didn't realize you were quoting cass, not lizra. But my answer stands!
And it's very intriguing how people DO turn to prayer as a last resort - I think it shows that there is a very real sense of the presence of God in every person - we just don't want to acknowledge it, because it has so many frightening implications (there IS a being behind the universe - am I accountable to Him for my many evil acts?) (BTW, I'm not talking just murder here - Jesus equates just being angry with someone else with murder). (you see, it's all HEART issues!) But it is a FALSE fear (like someone with an operable disease who doesn't know much about doctors would be afraid), for the SOLUTION to this dilemma is provided by God - and actually, I don't want to get ahead of myself again. I'll just go ahead in the next post with the groundwork that I was talking about.
__________________
. I should be doing the laundry, but this is MUCH more fun! Ñá ë?* óú éä ïöü Öñ É Þ ð ß ® ç å ™ æ ♪ ?* "How lovely are Thy dwelling places, O Lord of hosts! ... For a day in Thy courts is better than a thousand outside." (from Psalm 84) * * * God rocks! Entmoot : Veni, vidi, velcro - I came, I saw, I got hooked! Ego numquam pronunciare mendacium, sed ego sum homo indomitus! Run the earth and watch the sky ... Auta i lómë! Aurë entuluva! |
10-31-2002, 06:17 PM | #250 |
Half-Elven Princess of Rabbit Trails and Harp-Wielding Administrator (beware the Rubber Chicken of Doom!)
Join Date: Sep 2002
Location: Not where I want to be ...
Posts: 15,254
|
(BTW, Lief, I think you misinterpreted Starr's post the same way that I did - I think what Starr was pointing out was - why did cass even bother to pray if she didn't believe in God? )
Is that right, Starr? BTW, that's a good point about answered prayers - sometimes we ask, then we don't even notice the answer! But God is faithful.
__________________
. I should be doing the laundry, but this is MUCH more fun! Ñá ë?* óú éä ïöü Öñ É Þ ð ß ® ç å ™ æ ♪ ?* "How lovely are Thy dwelling places, O Lord of hosts! ... For a day in Thy courts is better than a thousand outside." (from Psalm 84) * * * God rocks! Entmoot : Veni, vidi, velcro - I came, I saw, I got hooked! Ego numquam pronunciare mendacium, sed ego sum homo indomitus! Run the earth and watch the sky ... Auta i lómë! Aurë entuluva! |
10-31-2002, 06:21 PM | #251 |
Elf Lord
Join Date: Dec 2000
Location: Fountain Valley, CA
Posts: 6,343
|
I actually think that people turn to God, when in difficulty, out of desperation when they can't think of anything else to do. I could be wrong though.
|
10-31-2002, 06:23 PM | #252 | |
I am Freddie/UNDERCOVER/ Founder of The Great Continent of Entmoot
Join Date: Dec 2001
Location: Plainsboro, NJ
Posts: 9,431
|
Quote:
And I thought this was a thread about Evolution being taught in school - not whether there is a god or not.
__________________
Come back! Come back! To Mordor we will take you! "The only thing better than a great plan is implementing a great plan" - JerseyDevil "If everyone agreed with me all the time, everything would be just fine"- JerseyDevil AboutNewJersey.com New Jersey MessageBoard Another Tolkien Forum Memorial to the Twin Towers New Jersey Map Fellowship of the Messageboard Legend of the Jersey Devil Support New Jersey's Liberty Tower Peacefire.org AboutNewJersey.com - New Jersey Travel and Tourism Guide Last edited by jerseydevil : 10-31-2002 at 06:26 PM. |
|
10-31-2002, 06:34 PM | #253 |
Elf Lord
Join Date: Dec 2000
Location: Fountain Valley, CA
Posts: 6,343
|
It is. It's also a contravertial thread prone to tangents, and this is a big one.
If the original topic revives, then so be it. I won't object. |
10-31-2002, 06:35 PM | #254 |
Half-Elven Princess of Rabbit Trails and Harp-Wielding Administrator (beware the Rubber Chicken of Doom!)
Join Date: Sep 2002
Location: Not where I want to be ...
Posts: 15,254
|
That's certainly the title of the thread, and the people involved in the last few pages of posts have given their opinion on that topic and discussed it at great length, and we are now discussing issues that have arisen from the thoughts expressed about the thead topic. As long as it's ok with the mods, I think it's a very interesting discussion and I'd like to continue, for one.
__________________
. I should be doing the laundry, but this is MUCH more fun! Ñá ë?* óú éä ïöü Öñ É Þ ð ß ® ç å ™ æ ♪ ?* "How lovely are Thy dwelling places, O Lord of hosts! ... For a day in Thy courts is better than a thousand outside." (from Psalm 84) * * * God rocks! Entmoot : Veni, vidi, velcro - I came, I saw, I got hooked! Ego numquam pronunciare mendacium, sed ego sum homo indomitus! Run the earth and watch the sky ... Auta i lómë! Aurë entuluva! |
10-31-2002, 06:41 PM | #255 | |
Elf Lord
Join Date: Dec 2000
Location: Fountain Valley, CA
Posts: 6,343
|
Quote:
|
|
10-31-2002, 06:50 PM | #256 | ||
Half-Elven Princess of Rabbit Trails and Harp-Wielding Administrator (beware the Rubber Chicken of Doom!)
Join Date: Sep 2002
Location: Not where I want to be ...
Posts: 15,254
|
I"ll start with a quote from jerseydevil:
Quote:
Quote:
BTW, let me just state here that I'm not trying to do something tricky here! I am, however, trying to present some things that are not usually thought about, and I would like you to honestly think about them and evaluate honestly if you think they are true or not. I sure hope that you people will grant that I have been intellectually honest (whether or not you agree with my statements!) in the sense that I giving you my own thoughts, which I believe to be true, on the issues. I'm NOT, in any sense, trying to get you to believe something that I think is UNTRUE in order to snooker you into becoming a Christian! (i.e., "if I can just get them to swallow this ONE fib, then they'll become Christians, which I know is better for them, anyway - BWAHAHA!) OK, I'm done with the post finally.
__________________
. I should be doing the laundry, but this is MUCH more fun! Ñá ë?* óú éä ïöü Öñ É Þ ð ß ® ç å ™ æ ♪ ?* "How lovely are Thy dwelling places, O Lord of hosts! ... For a day in Thy courts is better than a thousand outside." (from Psalm 84) * * * God rocks! Entmoot : Veni, vidi, velcro - I came, I saw, I got hooked! Ego numquam pronunciare mendacium, sed ego sum homo indomitus! Run the earth and watch the sky ... Auta i lómë! Aurë entuluva! Last edited by Rían : 10-31-2002 at 07:13 PM. |
||
10-31-2002, 06:56 PM | #257 |
Domesticated Swing Babe
Join Date: May 2002
Location: Reality
Posts: 5,340
|
I don't have a vending machine mentality towards prayer, really! I was just being polite to LE because that's the direction his posts about how God will "reveal" himself,seemed to be going.
LE, I'm fairly intellegent, and have been through many trials and tribulations over the years. You really aren't telling me anything new. I simply don't buy it.
__________________
Happy Atheist Go Democrats! |
10-31-2002, 07:01 PM | #258 | |
Hoplite Nomad
Join Date: Sep 2001
Posts: 3,931
|
Quote:
ERROR LE, 1) its a matter of time which I did not have 2)and prudence. it not better to read the original soucre than my second hand source To sum up the belief in god has biological roots. The switch above was (freewill) was a response to your comment bringing freewill in. However, the THREAD is about evolution NOT about belief "attacking" belief we should drop this and get back on track so can we ( everyone posting) get back on track
__________________
About Eowyn, Does anyone know what her alias Dernhelm means? She was kown as dernhelm because of her exclaimation when she realized that the rider's headgear was heavy and obscured her sight. 'Dern Helm" Culled from Entmoot From Kirinski 57 and Wayfarer. Last edited by afro-elf : 10-31-2002 at 07:06 PM. |
|
10-31-2002, 07:05 PM | #259 |
Elf Lord
Join Date: Dec 2000
Location: Fountain Valley, CA
Posts: 6,343
|
Sorry if we misunderstood you, and we didn't mean to jump all over you. We were simply concerned that you were leaving, planning to act, but were certainly going to be disappointed because you were going about it wrong.
Ah, by the way, which part of what I said don't you buy? Or is it all of it? It actually doesn't matter, it's entirely up to you whether you believe what I've said or not. I'm definitely not expecting anyone to take what I'm saying on my word alone. All that I'm trying to do is to convince you and others to give the God that I believe in a chance. |
10-31-2002, 07:07 PM | #260 |
Hoplite Nomad
Join Date: Sep 2001
Posts: 3,931
|
You posted while I was typing
__________________
About Eowyn, Does anyone know what her alias Dernhelm means? She was kown as dernhelm because of her exclaimation when she realized that the rider's headgear was heavy and obscured her sight. 'Dern Helm" Culled from Entmoot From Kirinski 57 and Wayfarer. |
|
|
Similar Threads | ||||
Thread | Thread Starter | Forum | Replies | Last Post |
Evidence for Evolution | jerseydevil | General Messages | 599 | 05-18-2008 02:43 PM |
Catholic Schools Ban Charity | Last Child of Ungoliant | General Messages | 29 | 03-15-2005 04:58 PM |
Evidence for Creationism and Against Evolution | Rían | General Messages | 1149 | 08-16-2004 06:07 PM |
A discussion about Evolution and other scientific theories | Elvellon | General Messages | 1 | 04-11-2002 01:23 PM |
Evolution | IronParrot | Entertainment Forum | 1 | 06-19-2001 03:22 AM |