02-01-2005, 11:26 AM | #241 | ||
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The benefit for taking your car into downtown London has to outweigh what you pay in terms of time, maintenance to your car, hassle, etc. A toll increases this cost, meaning for more people the cost will outweigh the benefit of driving downtown, and they'll take the train or bus instead.
This can apply to driving anywhere, with different costs and benefits. Personally I think the same should be done in Vancouver, where the bus/train system is good enough to accomodate the increased demand. The toll would go to improving the transit system. This has already happened to a certain degree with a bus pass being included in our student fees at UBC (University of British Columbia). Ridership increased significantly on common student routes, much more than expected. People get used to a new toll in the sense that they stop complaining about it, but if they still keep driving, that just means that the benefit of driving still outweighs the costs including the toll.
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02-01-2005, 11:30 AM | #242 |
Elf Lord
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I'm sure we will. And when we do, it will be based on facts gained from a real experiment. Sitting around debating every what if and maybe just produces a lot of hot air, it takes someone to actually try something out to truly inform the debate. Which, much as I hate to heap any praise on Landahners, is what they've been bold enough to try.
Whatever the long term impact, at least there will be some data to inform other cities - rather than just opinion.
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02-01-2005, 11:52 AM | #243 | ||
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02-01-2005, 01:04 PM | #244 |
Elf Lord
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IMO it has worked very well: there is noticeably less traffic inside the charging zone (I travel there a couple of times a month), which means that buses, bikes and taxis get around quicker. Friends who cycle in London (not me as I value my life too much) tell me that it's made their lives much more pleasant.
The GLA should take a lot of credit for a courageous move. The charge is limited to peak hours, so it encourages flexible working. It's been accompanied by a huge increase in people using the buses in London (while bus journeys have declined elsewhere). One thing, though: it coincided with the Central Line underground going offline after a crash (which carries around 600k passengers per day), so maybe that forced people onto buses. Bizarrely, I head a rumour that City brokers were swapping their 4x4s for minibuses so that they could commute and be exempt. |
02-01-2005, 04:50 PM | #245 |
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I agree with the congestion charge and I think it's worked quite well. I'm not too sure about the application of the word 'genius' to ol' Kenny though...
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02-01-2005, 04:54 PM | #246 |
The Intermittent One
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i like ken, and i like the congestion charge
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02-01-2005, 05:02 PM | #247 |
The Blobbit
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No, I don't grudge you that. I just think, of all the people to whom one could apply that term, I would pick an Einstein or a Hawking or someone not a physicist, but not really Ken.
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Janny's Songs Janny's lyrics and random photographs Tradition means giving votes to the most obscure of all classes, our ancestors. It is the democracy of the dead. Tradition refuses to submit to the small and arrogant oligarchy of those who happen to be walking about. ~ Mercutio... erm, GK Chesterton. |
02-01-2005, 05:10 PM | #248 | |
I am Freddie/UNDERCOVER/ Founder of The Great Continent of Entmoot
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All the bridges and tunnels into and out of Manhattan are tolls (except for brookyn bridge I think isn't a toll bridge). Also - regardless of what type of vehicle you drive - even buses must pay a toll (although their's is cheaper). I found a site with the toll charges - with e-z pass a car entering manhattan off peak is $4 - on peak it's $5 and if you pay cash then it's $6 regardless of the time. There is also a carpool rate of only $1 and this requires enrollment and having 3 or more persons in the car. These prices affect the following.... Lincoln Tunnel Holland Tunnel George Washington Bridge Goethals Bridge Outbridge Crossing Bayonne Bridge for more information on the tolls - you can look at the Port Authority website - Toll Rates (PDF) All these are entrances from NJ to NY.
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Come back! Come back! To Mordor we will take you! "The only thing better than a great plan is implementing a great plan" - JerseyDevil "If everyone agreed with me all the time, everything would be just fine"- JerseyDevil AboutNewJersey.com New Jersey MessageBoard Another Tolkien Forum Memorial to the Twin Towers New Jersey Map Fellowship of the Messageboard Legend of the Jersey Devil Support New Jersey's Liberty Tower Peacefire.org AboutNewJersey.com - New Jersey Travel and Tourism Guide Last edited by jerseydevil : 02-01-2005 at 05:12 PM. |
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02-01-2005, 05:13 PM | #249 | |
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up there with Che Guevara and Me! |
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02-01-2005, 05:27 PM | #250 |
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Don't get Janny started on Che Guevara...
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And all the time the waves, the waves, the waves Chase, intersect and flatten on the sand As they have done for centuries, as they will For centuries to come, when not a soul Is left to picnic on the blazing rocks, When England is not England, when mankind Has blown himself to pieces. Still the sea, Consolingly disastrous, will return While the strange starfish, hugely magnified, Waits in the jewelled basin of a pool. |
02-01-2005, 05:29 PM | #251 | |
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one of my heroes, is Che! Talking like Yoda, why am I? |
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02-02-2005, 04:10 PM | #252 |
Lady of Letters
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http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/uk_politics/4227921.stm
I know Kilroy-Silk's a joke and everything, but doesn't it make you feel all warm and fuzzy about democracy and pluralism?
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And all the time the waves, the waves, the waves Chase, intersect and flatten on the sand As they have done for centuries, as they will For centuries to come, when not a soul Is left to picnic on the blazing rocks, When England is not England, when mankind Has blown himself to pieces. Still the sea, Consolingly disastrous, will return While the strange starfish, hugely magnified, Waits in the jewelled basin of a pool. |
02-02-2005, 04:43 PM | #253 | |
I am Freddie/UNDERCOVER/ Founder of The Great Continent of Entmoot
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Come back! Come back! To Mordor we will take you! "The only thing better than a great plan is implementing a great plan" - JerseyDevil "If everyone agreed with me all the time, everything would be just fine"- JerseyDevil AboutNewJersey.com New Jersey MessageBoard Another Tolkien Forum Memorial to the Twin Towers New Jersey Map Fellowship of the Messageboard Legend of the Jersey Devil Support New Jersey's Liberty Tower Peacefire.org AboutNewJersey.com - New Jersey Travel and Tourism Guide |
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02-02-2005, 04:51 PM | #254 |
The Intermittent One
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whats his new party called again? Veritas? makes you laugh
BTW, JD, the people that stand at the end of an answer are waiting to be acknowledged by the speaker, as they have a question or point to raise |
02-02-2005, 05:10 PM | #255 | ||
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However, anti-EU feeling is quite strong in Britain, certainly compared to other European countries - so that for example, about 60% are still opposed to joining the single currency. Around 30% are opposed to the Constitution (the European average is 16%). The history of Britain's relationship with the EU has always progressed by a series of single issues - whether we should adopt free movement of labour, Maastricht, the Euro, Nice, the Constitution... The argument is always the same, and people have been generally opposed to these things and warned that the EU's going to take over. But then they happen anyway and the world doesn't end. The EU is one of those issues where the political parties don't really reflect the popular opinion - no political parties are strongly opposed to the EU (though the Tories say they would 'roll back' our membership a little bit if they were in power). Hence, in my opinion, the attention given to UKIP.
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And all the time the waves, the waves, the waves Chase, intersect and flatten on the sand As they have done for centuries, as they will For centuries to come, when not a soul Is left to picnic on the blazing rocks, When England is not England, when mankind Has blown himself to pieces. Still the sea, Consolingly disastrous, will return While the strange starfish, hugely magnified, Waits in the jewelled basin of a pool. |
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02-08-2005, 02:52 PM | #256 |
Elf Lord
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Election fever is coming on, or at least, the pundits are desperate for us to believe it's coming on, so what do y'all think?
What are the key issues going to be? Is there any point in voting Lib Dem? Who will be the Official Monster Raving Loony Party candidate in Sedgefield? Do people really care as much about immigration as the politicians seem to think we do? Is anyone else disgusted about the Daily Mail setting the political agenda? |
02-08-2005, 02:56 PM | #257 |
The Intermittent One
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politicians care about immigration, the only members of the public who do read the telegraph or the mail
i wonder if the LCA will put up a candidate in bridgwater, might tempt me into voting for someone, then!! |
02-08-2005, 05:16 PM | #258 |
The Blobbit
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I'd rather The Mail set the political agenda than The Guardi... actually, you're right.
What do you think of the proposed (and scrapped) Labour election posters? Especially now it is clear Alistar Campbell had a personal hand in it. (He responded to the Beeb's interview request with the words: 'F**k off and cover something important, you t**ts'. He claimed it was an email meant for someone else. Well, that's okay then )
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Janny's Songs Janny's lyrics and random photographs Tradition means giving votes to the most obscure of all classes, our ancestors. It is the democracy of the dead. Tradition refuses to submit to the small and arrogant oligarchy of those who happen to be walking about. ~ Mercutio... erm, GK Chesterton. |
02-08-2005, 06:29 PM | #259 |
The Intermittent One
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hey! i read the guardian
anything alistair campbell has a hand in should be scrapped before even being thought of |
02-08-2005, 07:18 PM | #260 | ||||
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Is now a good time to listen to Monty Python's Election Special?
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"I can add some more, if you'd like it. Calling your Chief Names, Wishing to Punch his Pimply Face, and Thinking you Shirriffs look a lot of Tom-fools." - Sam Gamgee, p. 340, Return of the King Quote:
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