09-21-2003, 08:13 PM | #2021 |
Half-Elven Princess of Rabbit Trails and Harp-Wielding Administrator (beware the Rubber Chicken of Doom!)
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Oh, and one more thing re Eärniel's answer -
There IS one category of event for which God uses the word "if" ... does anyone know?
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. I should be doing the laundry, but this is MUCH more fun! Ñá ë?* óú éä ïöü Öñ É Þ ð ß ® ç Ã¥ â„¢ æ ♪ ?* "How lovely are Thy dwelling places, O Lord of hosts! ... For a day in Thy courts is better than a thousand outside." (from Psalm 84) * * * God rocks! Entmoot : Veni, vidi, velcro - I came, I saw, I got hooked! Ego numquam pronunciare mendacium, sed ego sum homo indomitus! Run the earth and watch the sky ... Auta i lómë! Aurë entuluva! |
09-22-2003, 02:08 AM | #2022 |
Elf Lord
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Mmm. The one that immediately pops to mind is "If Israel turns to sin, then I will punish it," but I'm not sure that's the one you mean .
That one didn't even apply only to Israel, though. The Lord applied it to other nations as well, as we can see in cases such as Jonah and the Assyrian Empire, and Daniel and the Babylonian Empire. Israel is certainly the most obvious case though, for that is the one that the Bible focuses most strongly upon, in the Old Testament, when they're really talking about physical events with other nations. |
09-22-2003, 10:03 AM | #2023 | |||
The Chocoholic Sea Elf Administrator
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Quote:
Quote:
There's this quote about a splinter and a planck in someone's eye that springs to mind but I can't remember the English translation... Quote:
I just don't understand the bit about persons. Are you saying that since God is, well, basically God (all-knowing, all-powerful, all... you get the idea) that we should trust in his good judgment of the situation and be content with it?
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We are not things. |
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09-22-2003, 02:34 PM | #2024 | |
Fëanáro's Fire Mistress
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09-22-2003, 09:41 PM | #2025 | |
Half-Elven Princess of Rabbit Trails and Harp-Wielding Administrator (beware the Rubber Chicken of Doom!)
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Arien, do you agree with my comment on her question?
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. I should be doing the laundry, but this is MUCH more fun! Ñá ë?* óú éä ïöü Öñ É Þ ð ß ® ç Ã¥ â„¢ æ ♪ ?* "How lovely are Thy dwelling places, O Lord of hosts! ... For a day in Thy courts is better than a thousand outside." (from Psalm 84) * * * God rocks! Entmoot : Veni, vidi, velcro - I came, I saw, I got hooked! Ego numquam pronunciare mendacium, sed ego sum homo indomitus! Run the earth and watch the sky ... Auta i lómë! Aurë entuluva! |
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09-22-2003, 10:06 PM | #2026 | |
Fëanáro's Fire Mistress
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I'm not sure..what was your comment on her question? I'm really lazy today and don't want to spend the time looking for it |
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09-22-2003, 10:25 PM | #2027 |
Half-Elven Princess of Rabbit Trails and Harp-Wielding Administrator (beware the Rubber Chicken of Doom!)
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never mind the comment - no big deal
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. I should be doing the laundry, but this is MUCH more fun! Ñá ë?* óú éä ïöü Öñ É Þ ð ß ® ç Ã¥ â„¢ æ ♪ ?* "How lovely are Thy dwelling places, O Lord of hosts! ... For a day in Thy courts is better than a thousand outside." (from Psalm 84) * * * God rocks! Entmoot : Veni, vidi, velcro - I came, I saw, I got hooked! Ego numquam pronunciare mendacium, sed ego sum homo indomitus! Run the earth and watch the sky ... Auta i lómë! Aurë entuluva! |
09-23-2003, 01:29 PM | #2028 | |
Lady of Lamedon
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Thank you all for your oppinions.
Quote:
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"I don't know half of you half as well as I should like; and I like less than half of you half as well as you deserve." Jesus scares the "hell" out of people! He rocks! http://linwe.proboards19.com/index.cgi |
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09-23-2003, 01:40 PM | #2029 | |
Quasi Evil
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Quote:
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"People's political beliefs don't stem from the factual information they've acquired. Far more the facts people choose to believe are the product of their political beliefs." "Injustice anywhere is a threat to justice everywhere." |
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09-23-2003, 05:25 PM | #2030 | |
Fëanáro's Fire Mistress
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09-23-2003, 05:41 PM | #2031 |
Half-Elven Princess of Rabbit Trails and Harp-Wielding Administrator (beware the Rubber Chicken of Doom!)
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*has fond memories of playing dodge ball*
*was darn good at it*
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. I should be doing the laundry, but this is MUCH more fun! Ñá ë?* óú éä ïöü Öñ É Þ ð ß ® ç Ã¥ â„¢ æ ♪ ?* "How lovely are Thy dwelling places, O Lord of hosts! ... For a day in Thy courts is better than a thousand outside." (from Psalm 84) * * * God rocks! Entmoot : Veni, vidi, velcro - I came, I saw, I got hooked! Ego numquam pronunciare mendacium, sed ego sum homo indomitus! Run the earth and watch the sky ... Auta i lómë! Aurë entuluva! |
09-23-2003, 06:28 PM | #2032 |
Elven Warrior
Join Date: Sep 2003
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Thanks to my parents, I have been to many many different churches. My father somehow found fault with each of them. Catholic, Baptist, Methodist, Lutheran....you name it. Pretty crazy. I-unlike one of my siblings-did not turn away from christianity because of all my parent's undecidedness. I would say it made me stronger in my faith and gave me a knowledge of what is out there. I also saw many different types of people in these churches...some with more faith than others. I am now Russian Orthodox christian. 'Christian' is the key word here people. 'Denomination' is something else. It certainly would be wonderful if everyone could worship together in harmony, but, sadly, this can never happen. It just doesn't work.
And what is up with this dodgeball thing? Of course Catholics play contact sports. If any of your friends think dodgeball is evil, its because of their twisted upbringing...javascript:smilie('') |
09-23-2003, 11:25 PM | #2033 |
Lady of Lamedon
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I guess I never thought of Catholicism and Christianity like that. Makes sence. Thank you for clearing up that little mess, and the dodge ball thing. These girls are really odd, they never wear anything other than a long-sleave turtle neck and dresse/skirts that go past their ankles. They are strange girls. I have always wanted to learn more about other religions (I have no clue what a "Lutheran" is, but have heard of "Orthadox") but, unfortunately, never got to study about it. I know a lot about Catholics because of my friends, but for all those other religions, I am tuff out of luck! I can't just pick up one of their bibles and study it.
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"I don't know half of you half as well as I should like; and I like less than half of you half as well as you deserve." Jesus scares the "hell" out of people! He rocks! http://linwe.proboards19.com/index.cgi |
09-23-2003, 11:52 PM | #2034 |
Quasi Evil
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well yer in the right thread if you have questions. and hopefully as you get older youll emerge from your little hole in the sand and see the big broad world as it really is in all is flavors and variaties. it can only be a good experience to learn more about the world.
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"People's political beliefs don't stem from the factual information they've acquired. Far more the facts people choose to believe are the product of their political beliefs." "Injustice anywhere is a threat to justice everywhere." |
09-24-2003, 12:03 AM | #2035 | |
Fëanáro's Fire Mistress
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09-24-2003, 12:48 AM | #2036 | |
Half-Elven Princess of Rabbit Trails and Harp-Wielding Administrator (beware the Rubber Chicken of Doom!)
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So the basic general category is *drumroll* : a person's choices. So we see that God, the creator of the universe, has indeed made mankind in His image (note- image, not identical or equal, for it is impossible for created beings to be on the same scale as their Creator), in the sense that people have free choice. Now it is limited free choice, but free choice many, MANY areas. And one way people use free choice is to inflict suffering on others. This free choice is limited both in scope and in duration, however, and people will be judged according to their choices on the day of judgement. However, the Bible also says that God is delaying this day in order to let as many people as possible make the free choice to accept His gift of salvation.
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. I should be doing the laundry, but this is MUCH more fun! Ñá ë?* óú éä ïöü Öñ É Þ ð ß ® ç Ã¥ â„¢ æ ♪ ?* "How lovely are Thy dwelling places, O Lord of hosts! ... For a day in Thy courts is better than a thousand outside." (from Psalm 84) * * * God rocks! Entmoot : Veni, vidi, velcro - I came, I saw, I got hooked! Ego numquam pronunciare mendacium, sed ego sum homo indomitus! Run the earth and watch the sky ... Auta i lómë! Aurë entuluva! |
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09-24-2003, 12:57 AM | #2037 | |
Half-Elven Princess of Rabbit Trails and Harp-Wielding Administrator (beware the Rubber Chicken of Doom!)
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It's kinda more like my husband, who has good judgement, but also has a great heart... it's not just dry judgement, there is good character involved, too... Sorry I can't express it better - I'll have to put the thought back on the "back burner" to simmer a bit more
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. I should be doing the laundry, but this is MUCH more fun! Ñá ë?* óú éä ïöü Öñ É Þ ð ß ® ç Ã¥ â„¢ æ ♪ ?* "How lovely are Thy dwelling places, O Lord of hosts! ... For a day in Thy courts is better than a thousand outside." (from Psalm 84) * * * God rocks! Entmoot : Veni, vidi, velcro - I came, I saw, I got hooked! Ego numquam pronunciare mendacium, sed ego sum homo indomitus! Run the earth and watch the sky ... Auta i lómë! Aurë entuluva! |
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09-24-2003, 01:01 AM | #2038 | |
Half-Elven Princess of Rabbit Trails and Harp-Wielding Administrator (beware the Rubber Chicken of Doom!)
Join Date: Sep 2002
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Quote:
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. I should be doing the laundry, but this is MUCH more fun! Ñá ë?* óú éä ïöü Öñ É Þ ð ß ® ç Ã¥ â„¢ æ ♪ ?* "How lovely are Thy dwelling places, O Lord of hosts! ... For a day in Thy courts is better than a thousand outside." (from Psalm 84) * * * God rocks! Entmoot : Veni, vidi, velcro - I came, I saw, I got hooked! Ego numquam pronunciare mendacium, sed ego sum homo indomitus! Run the earth and watch the sky ... Auta i lómë! Aurë entuluva! |
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09-24-2003, 01:19 AM | #2039 |
Half-Elven Princess of Rabbit Trails and Harp-Wielding Administrator (beware the Rubber Chicken of Doom!)
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So let me try to get an initial overall post on what I understand to be the Biblical view on suffering - I've just been kinda jumping around, touching on various points, and now I'll make a first cut at putting it all together. I'll put numbers on for reference.
1) God is a unique Being - He has no beginning and no end - He is omnipotent, perfectly holy, and righteous, among other things . He created the universe, and created mankind in His image. This includes the ability to make free will choices in many, many areas. However, this free will is limited in both scope and duration. 2) Kind of a subset of 1), but it's very important - people are NOT on the same level as God, and never will be. And this is good. And this is real, as well as realistic. (whoops - this reminded me of one more area that I wanted to touch on! Analogies of God/mankind relationship. I guess I'll just put it as number 3.) 3) One of the more interesting things in the Bible are some of the terms used to describe the relationship between man and God (and I'll use "man" in the sense of "mankind" from now on). Because the interesting thing is that there is NO exact analogy for this relationship. But there are several quite useful ones that describe, somewhat, different aspects of the relationship. One is artist/artifact (God is the potter, we are the clay). Another is shepherd/flock (Jesus is our good shepherd, we are His sheep). Another is parent/child (both male/female, and animal and human - God as some kind of mothering bird, IIRC, longing to gather us under his wings, and then God as a mother loving her child, as in the verse I quoted in the post on God's love for us, and of course the major one of God as our heavenly Father). Another is husband/wife, which is seen over and over in mostly the OT (God the king loving and marrying a lovely but obscure maiden, then the maiden playing the harlot and God longing for her return. Also the church referred to as the bride of Christ). These are useful analogies in various ways, and all point out the leadership, or rightful authority, or caretaker roles of God towards people. The parent/child is perhaps the closest in many ways, and in THAT light, one can see that the parent knows best, and then it makes sense that God would know best for us. Where it fails, however, is that for humans, the child will eventually grow up and be a peer to his/her parents. However, whether we like it or not, the reality is that humans will never be a peer to God. And now I'm out of time, but that's probably enough for one session, anyway
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. I should be doing the laundry, but this is MUCH more fun! Ñá ë?* óú éä ïöü Öñ É Þ ð ß ® ç Ã¥ â„¢ æ ♪ ?* "How lovely are Thy dwelling places, O Lord of hosts! ... For a day in Thy courts is better than a thousand outside." (from Psalm 84) * * * God rocks! Entmoot : Veni, vidi, velcro - I came, I saw, I got hooked! Ego numquam pronunciare mendacium, sed ego sum homo indomitus! Run the earth and watch the sky ... Auta i lómë! Aurë entuluva! Last edited by RÃan : 09-24-2003 at 01:21 AM. |
09-24-2003, 03:08 AM | #2040 | |
Elf Lord
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Quote:
It also appears in the Nicene Creed of 381 AD
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Glendower: I can call spirits from the vasty deep. Hotspur: Why, so can I, or so can any man; But will they come when you do call for them? "I like pigs. Dogs look up to us, cats look down on us, but pigs treat us as equals."- Winston Churchill |
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