UK Politics

[sun-star]

Originally Posted by Telcontar_Dunedain

Yet with Big Brother the cameras in there are open for everyone to see yet the CCTV cameras aren't broadcasted acroos the TV. Only certain people can see them, not just anyone.

Exactly, and most of them aren't being watched at all. Speed cameras are automatic and many security cameras just make tapes which are destroyed after a certain time if they aren't needed.

(At least this is how it used to be. I bow to anyone of superior knowledge, of course )

And a footnote to the hunting discussion:

Hours of Parliamentary time spent on decision to ban fox-hunting: 700
Hours of Parliamentary time spent on decision to go to war in Iraq: 7

according to Private Eye anyway

[Janny]

Unbelievable!

A little too unbelievable...

[sun-star]

Originally Posted by Janny

A little too unbelievable...

I know... but it's probably roughly true. There were only a handful of debates on Iraq, I think (if you exclude questions in PMQs), and the hunting thing has been going for years.

[Janny]

Yes... especially given which is more important...

[jerseydevil]

Originally Posted by Telcontar_Dunedain

Yet with Big Brother the cameras in there are open for everyone to see yet the CCTV cameras aren't broadcasted acroos the TV. Only certain people can see them, not just anyone.

Big Brother has nothing to do with them beign broadcast - big brother is the government. It's the fact that your everymove is tracked and recorded. The cameras are the first part of a slippery slope in my opinion. What about just getting some damn cops to walk the area - instead of having spy cameras? It costs more - yeah - but your privacy is much more protected.

[Telcontar_Dunedain]

But not every move you make is being tracked. In your house know one knows what you are doing unless they are there. In your car as long as you aren't going over the limit or don't go through a red light people don't know exacly what you are doing unless they are going the same spped as you and staring into your car. You make it sound as if there is a personal camera for every single on of us.

[jerseydevil]

Originally Posted by Telcontar_Dunedain

But not every move you make is being tracked. In your house know one knows what you are doing unless they are there. In your car as long as you aren't going over the limit or don't go through a red light people don't know exacly what you are doing unless they are going the same spped as you and staring into your car. You make it sound as if there is a personal camera for every single on of us.

Can you say there won't be in the future? As I said - it's a slippery slope. You seem very willing to allow some unknown stranger to follow you down the street with a camera - I'm sure you won't have problems with the next brilliant idea they come up with. I've seen the cameras - and you can actually follow someone down the street with them - by jumping from camera to camera and zooming in and out.

[Telcontar_Dunedain]

But the strangers are the people who preotect us. Not some mad lunatic.

[jerseydevil]

Originally Posted by Telcontar_Dunedain

But the strangers are the people who preotect us. Not some mad lunatic.

No - they are just people. You have never heard of "bad cops" before - or are all the people in power in the UK perfect? With that attitude - why don't you just let the government do whatever it wants to?

[Telcontar_Dunedain]

I have heard of abd cops but there are also good cops. A bad cop doesn't need a security camera to watch someones every move, they'll be able to do somethng else. But we trust these people with our safety, and those cameras are there to try and help with our safety.

[jerseydevil]

Originally Posted by Telcontar_Dunedain

I have heard of abd cops but there are also good cops. A bad cop doesn't need a security camera to watch someones every move, they'll be able to do somethng else. But we trust these people with our safety, and those cameras are there to try and help with our safety.

yes and that attitude is how all governments have been able to take away the privacy and freedoms of their people without a backlash. By the time the people realized that the freedoms and privacy they gave up were being abused - it was too late. You don't have to go that far in history to see government abuse.

[Telcontar_Dunedain]

If the British had a problem with this then they would stop it. Wether it meant tearing all the cameras down or whatever. We'd make sure it stopped. But this sin't happening because we don't see the government abusing their power.

[Last Child of Ungoliant]

a little aside on all these smoking/alcohol/bad food debates:

A lady I know drinks 3 litres of whisky a week, up until 4 years ago smoked
60 a day, and continually eats things like burger and chips and other such
deep fried, red-light foods.
On November 6th, she celebrated her 103rd birthday and her mind is
still perfectly active - so if that doesn't put two fingers up to the
nanny-state, then i don't know what does.

[Draken]

Originally Posted by Last Child of Ungoliant

a little aside on all these smoking/alcohol/bad food debates:

A lady I know drinks 3 litres of whisky a week, up until 4 years ago smoked
60 a day, and continually eats things like burger and chips and other such
deep fried, red-light foods.
On November 6th, she celebrated her 103rd birthday and her mind is
still perfectly active - so if that doesn't put two fingers up to the
nanny-state, then i don't know what does.

Yeah and there was a woman who survived a 10km fall from an airliner without a parachute - that doesn't make it a good idea.

[Draken]

Originally Posted by Telcontar_Dunedain

If the British had a problem with this then they would stop it. Wether it meant tearing all the cameras down or whatever. We'd make sure it stopped. But this sin't happening because we don't see the government abusing their power.

Now, now TD listen and learn! You must learn to regard your government as both an utterly incompetent waste of tax* AND a highly sophisticated and - erm - competent tool of oppression. Without the word 'irony' ever crossing your mind, too.

*unless said tax is spent on a) huge armed forces and b) looking for a war to justify a)

[The Gaffer]

Originally Posted by Telcontar_Dunedain

If the British had a problem with this then they would stop it. Wether it meant tearing all the cameras down or whatever. We'd make sure it stopped. But this sin't happening because we don't see the government abusing their power.

We'll see when we're required to carry out ID cards around with us all the time. Most people agree that security cameras have succeeded in reducing speeding on the roads, although the jury's out on street crime.

I too am concerned about this. It's not just the current shower of careerists who govern us we have to worry about, but what about the next lot, or the lot after that, who will inherit the infrastructure for totalitarianism.

Without a written constitution, it's essential that these things are kept in check. Thankfully, the Human Rights Act may help.

[Last Child of Ungoliant]

For those that don't know, questions, and answers, for my new system of government start from this link (below) in the imagine thread.
Imagine if I were PM

[sun-star]

If you were PM, Chrys, how would you deal with David Blunkett?

[Last Child of Ungoliant]

Originally Posted by sun-star

If you were PM, Chrys, how would you deal with David Blunkett?

i think he should be sacked immediately,
he has abused his power in 'fast-tracking' the nanny
and should pay for it

how bout you?

[Draken]

Originally Posted by Last Child of Ungoliant

i think he should be sacked immediately,
he has abused his power in 'fast-tracking' the nanny
and should pay for it

how bout you?

Personally I'd never have appointed him. Even by political standards he is consistently simplistic in approach (eg his unfounded belief that public institutions can be exhorted to do better by publishing league tables, etc). His much vaunted improvements in academic standards have been shown to have been largely illusory. He picks a policy and bulldozes it through without pausing to check if it might actually achieve what he wants.