The Lord of the Rings discussion project

[Nurvingiel]

I'd say it is time all right. We have about 8 threads going around right now and I wouldn't want to see some of the older ones getting dropped off the list. Though, we can count on cee2lee2 to bump them up for us.

[cee2lee2]

Only the one time....I'm caught up now.

[Elanor the Fair]

Originally posted by azalea

BTW, we had talked earlier about a map detailing their progress. Has anyone been able to come up with one, a map that showed the journey? If so, could we post one in the current thread, from Crickhollow to the Old Forest? (And maybe if you're feeling really into it, you could post one in the ch.3&4 thread of the journey from Bag End to Crickhollow. )

Azalea,

I have book called "The Atlas of Middle Earth" (by Karen Wynn Fonstadd - printed 1981). It details every step of the journey from Hobbiton to Mt Doom via a series of detailed maps. The journey of the Fellowship is plotted on the maps with the dates included.

I don't know if anyone else has come up with a map for the discussion project. If it hasn't already been done, I could attempt to scan the relevant portions of the maps and post them in the appropriate chapters of the discussion project.

Please let me know if anyone is interested.

Elanor the Fair

[Valandil]

Originally posted by Elanor the Fair
I don't know if anyone else has come up with a map for the discussion project. If it hasn't already been done, I could attempt to scan the relevant portions of the maps and post them in the appropriate chapters of the discussion project.

Please let me know if anyone is interested.

Please do... that'd be great!

[Elanor the Fair]

I scanned the map, cropped it and tried to post it as an attachment, however, the file was too large and I couldn't get it any smaller without losing resolution. I am going to try something else later. I hope it works out!!

[Valandil]

Saw Fat Middle on a few days ago. Anyone know if he's due to get the next assignment posted in another week or so?

[Radagast The Brown]

Originally posted by Valandil
Saw Fat Middle on a few days ago. Anyone know if he's due to get the next assignment posted in another week or so?

I think he might not be ready. I don't know what you saw - but he said two 2-3 weeks ago that he's going on a trip for 3 months. I doubt he'll post the next assignment on time - in 5 days. Maybe we should appointa volunteer?

[Fat middle]

Originally Posted by Radagast The Brown

I think he might not be ready. I don't know what you saw - but he said two 2-3 weeks ago that he's going on a trip for 3 months. I doubt he'll post the next assignment on time - in 5 days. Maybe we should appointa volunteer?

Did I said three months? I meant three weeks, although I surely desired three months...

[Artanis]

Originally posted by Valandil
Saw Fat Middle on a few days ago. Anyone know if he's due to get the next assignment posted in another week or so?

FM is on a looooong vacation (oh, the envy! ) - I don't think he is aware that he should be doing the next chapter. When he was on a few days ago it was just for a quick peek.

[azalea]

His intro was due yesterday. I had PMed him last week as a reminder, but haven't heard from him. I'll try to contact him again, and if I haven't heard from him by Monday, I'll ask for a volunteer to do it, hopefully by Thurday the 29th. I can do it if no one else can. Thanks for your patience, guys.
In the meantime, be reading those chapters if you haven't already.

[Fat middle]

Originally Posted by azalea

His intro was due yesterday. I had PMed him last week as a reminder, but haven't heard from him. I'll try to contact him again, and if I haven't heard from him by Monday, I'll ask for a volunteer to do it, hopefully by Thurday the 29th. I can do it if no one else can. Thanks for your patience, guys.
In the meantime, be reading those chapters if you haven't already.

Did you say Monday? I'm back at home now and even at work (for the envious one: this smily is not mad enough to express my current state of mind )

I'll try to have it post on 29th. Sorry for the delay, azalea.

[azalea]

Originally Posted by Fat middle

Did you say Monday? I'm back at home now and even at work (for the envious one: this smily is not mad enough to express my current state of mind )

I'll try to have it post on 29th. Sorry for the delay, azalea.

No problem! Glad to have you back!

[Beren3000]

So Fat Middle, when are you going to post the intro? (Sorry for the nagging, but I just can't wait )

[ItalianLegolas]

This is a great project azalea, and a reeeeeeealy long one too... if there is anything i can do to help let me know

[Butterbeer]

mmmm.....


Azalea
The Lord of the Rings discussion project :

Certainly you may mention ties to the Silmarillion in discussing the chapters. Also, interesting factoids about the life of Tolkien are welcome

it will allow for wider participation for that reason, and part of the goal of this project is to revitalize this forum and to draw in new people,

1.Tell what is/ are the important main events of the chapter(s),

what you mean like the cursing of the dead of dunharrow?

2.Tell what you liked about this/ these chapter(s) – favorite part, scenes that were particularly funny, scary, descriptive, what stands out to you in the chapter.

what, like the fact a whole people or "folk' were cursed and why and how?

Let’s try just for these threads to say that the material contained in the text is canonical, whether or not HoME or other texts published later appear to refute it. I think this will serve to do a few things: it will “level the playing field” (not everyone has read the HoME, and some haven’t even read The Silm), it will allow for wider participation for that reason, and part of the goal of this project is to revitalize this forum and to draw in new people

i agree.

Let’s let everyone feel confident about sharing their views, Tolkien “scholar” and first time reader alike, without feeling like they’re going to be corrected for a “wrong” statement

Obviously a lot of what we discuss will have been discussed in other threads. That's okay. This is a separate project, and the other threads are for going into greater depth for a particular aspect of the books. Repitition is okay here.

[Butterbeer]

with the very best willed and friendliest of motives Val, i fail to see the point of a discussion thread about events in the LOTR, as outlined by the very project outlines themselves, that does not let, or allow or encourage mooters to discuss the relevant parts of the chapter???

firstly this is all friendly and encouraging .. it all (ok i'll give you the marrows ) stems from and relates to the issues of the passing of the grey company ... it fits all the outlines quoted above (ok, selectively, i admit)

but How on earth can we discuss the events, meanings and our thoughts and questions about the events of this chapter without, as Azalea said we could when defining the whole project, refering outside of the book when needed??? (PLUS some of this IS in the appendixes) ... also i understood it from the quote above and the original premise of the project to be CLEARLY UNDERSTOOD AND DEFINED ... that:


"Obviously a lot of what we discuss will have been discussed in other threads. That's okay. This is a separate project, and the other threads are for going into greater depth for a particular aspect of the books. Repitition is okay here. "

so, really, is it not a) unessecary to... and B) against the spirit of the thing...

... to curtail discussion here?

we are not intending to go into any great depth on any other subject , just musing about the story, meanings and how's, why's and what's of what is brought up in this very chapter!

Now, i am very glad YOU are the mod here Valandil because you are intelligent, likeable, reasonable and what's more a good writer yourself ...

so ,really, surely we have by Azalea's guidelines and aims for this project not only the right (which cannot be doubted) but also the strength (which, may be barely enough , and prove to be somewhat tougher than the batlle of Valandil's deep thought ) .... to discuss this and other things ...

very best, BB

oh and yes ..val ... i'd like to see YOU reply more in here too! (though on different lines from above - obviously! )

[Valandil]

BB - I certainly don't want to squelch discussion, but I can assure you that one of azalea's objectives was that the discussion for each chapter(s) remain on what happened in that chapter - or before, but not after - and not drawing from various other sources. The idea was to not intimidate the Tolkien novice, but to allow them to feel free to venture an opinion, without having all kinds of things thrown back in response from texts they had never heard of - rather than from the chapter under discussion.

There are a lot of you folks who know a lot around here, after all.

So - my comment was only in reference to Serenoli's mention of the Ban of Men and what befell Numenor - and your response to it and mention of Angmar.

And of course, you're certainly free to discuss those things. One great hope had been that the discussion starting in these chapters would launch new threads that would take the discussion deeper and COULD include those other sources (whether in LOTR forum, Silmarillion forum or Middle Earth forum). So go start a thread on it!

We want to keep these threads more focused though - on the material presented in that chapter, or to date in the chapters previously covered.

Unfortunately, azalea doesn't make it around as much, but if you're still uncertain, you're free to go ahead and PM her - and steer her this way to see if I have accurately captured her intent.

[Gordis]

You are both right and wrong, Val, I think.

Certainly, every thread should better stay on topic, who argues that. And the Ban of the Valar and the fate of Ar-Pharazon have very remote connection with the chapter in question.

The problem is that few people now venture into the Books forum. There has not been a real animated discussion for quite some time. It has become dull here, hasn't it? So, every lively discussion, like in this thread, should be encouraged. Like a wise Ent, careful not to stunt the delicate green growth, you better wait and observe and then - OOPS - you take the scissors and split the thread.

I know, I know, Val, splitting threads is such a hard work!

[Butterbeer]

I agree gor .. just feels like it's pointless coming here now ..we can't discuss the lord of the rings (in the main) in the lord of the rings discussion project thread for god's sake!

plus i am prepared to argue, that if you look at the quotes from azalea there is plenty of project guidelines that support both our aims of ACTUALLY having some discussion and that we break no rules ...

Azalea: Discussion project official guidelines:

Certainly you may mention ties to the Silmarillion in discussing the chapters. Also, interesting factoids about the life of Tolkien are welcome

it will allow for wider participation for that reason, and part of the goal of this project is to revitalize this forum and to draw in new people,

and part of the goal of this project is to revitalize this forum and to draw in new people

Obviously a lot of what we discuss will have been discussed in other threads. That's okay. This is a separate project, and the other threads are for going into greater depth for a particular aspect of the books. Repitition is okay here.

one project to bring them all ... and in the Lightness bind them... ....

isn't that partly the point?

you want hundreds of watered down tiny threads that no one can keep up with about every little thing that springs directly from a chapter discussion????

may i politely ask you to reconsider this Val?

[Earniel]

Actually, I'm with Valandil on this one. While I certainly think we should be able to take elements outside the LoTR books into account in this discussion, they should not be the center of the thread (they rightfully so deserve their own threads). I think, and I see it in the guidelines that azalea laid down also, that the current LoTR-chapter should still remain the main focus of each chapter-thread.

It is not because the book forum has little traffic now that we should concentrate all topics we want to discuss into the few currently active threads.

On a more personal note I've found it very enjoyable that the seperate chapter-discussions allow to focus on details from the chapters that would otherwise have gone unnoticed between the bigger themes and events of Tolkien's whole scope, such as the drowning of Numenor and the power of vows.

Now, on with the discussion, I'd say. (And I better go read it to be able to catch up and actually participate. )

Originally Posted by Gordis

Like a wise Ent, careful not to stunt the delicate green growth, you better wait and observe and then - OOPS - you take the scissors and split the thread.

Actually, no. As a wise Ent-wife I want to cultivate a race of mooters in my gardens that take the initiative to take the discussion to the proper thread instead of waiting for the mod-team to sort out the entangled greens. (At which I'll probably get the reply: No wonder you Ent-wives were exterminated... )