01-30-2006, 04:41 PM | #81 | |
Shape-shifting, men-grabbing NAZGUL
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01-30-2006, 09:05 PM | #82 | |
High King at Annuminas Administrator
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My Fanfic: Letters of Firiel Tales of Nolduryon Visitors Come to Court Ñ á ë ?* ó ú é ä ï ö Ö ñ É Þ ð ß ® ™ [Xurl=Xhttp://entmoot.tolkientrail.com/showthread.php?s=&postid=ABCXYZ#postABCXYZ]text[/Xurl] Splitting Threads is SUCH Hard Work!! |
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08-13-2006, 05:16 PM | #83 | |
Elf Lord
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5) Oddities and Questions
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Why grey? (as in grey company) Is this a metaphor for the twilight on many levels between the living an dead, and the living that may yet be on the road to either living or dead, or worse? Is it the uncertainty of their path or merely that either Black or white were already used and anyway had no descriptive emotion? What resonance does JRR aim to put into 'the passing of' the grey company? Personally i always thought there was more in the naming of the Chapter than mere musings... This whole chapter is pivotally based on the History of the Numenorean and their Arnorien and Gondorean heirs (rightful or not) .. Is it possible we could have this chapter without the Black stone of Erech? And what do we read into the this tone and or the powers of the Line of Elendil to curse a whole prople years beyond count? Is indeed this curse of all the people, 'the oath-breakers' any better or worse than the wholesale destruction of babies, children and women of Numenor? |
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08-15-2006, 06:47 AM | #84 | ||
Elf Lord
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Again, the power of oaths in M-E. Elrond was right to warn against hasty oath-making. It will get you. But also, of course, a lovely plot device to tie in with the ancient history and the ultimate defeat of Sauron. It is hard to see how this chapter could exist without Aragorn knowing of the curse and the rallying point of Erech. He would only have taken the Paths if he'd seen the Black Fleet in the Stone and been reminded of the words of the Seer. |
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08-28-2006, 08:45 AM | #85 |
Elf Lord
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I agree. The whole chapter would be impossible without the curse.
What power had the Kings to create such a curse? Gordis and Crazy Squirrel debated i think somewhere about the sorcerous side to the line of Numenor ... but is it more as the Gaffer hints above, that we see in this chapter, JRR's creating a mythology for the middle earth where indeed no oath should be taken lightly and that thus the power of an oath has a power in itself - is it thus that as they broke their oath not to aid Elendil / Isuldur, thus this was the power or invocation that allowed the Heirs of Numenor to curse a whole people? What of the oath they also broke to Sauron? For they, affraid of the wrath of Elendil / Ilsudir broke that too, being too affraid to aid him! Was this also a factor in the power of the curse laid on them? ......................................... any thoughts on the symbolism on the coming of Arargorn in the dark and grey out of the north being labelled 'the King of the dead'? 'the king of the dead is coming ...' ... do you think, perhaps this brought a wry smile to Tolkien's lips and a twinkle to his eye? Last edited by Butterbeer : 08-28-2006 at 08:48 AM. |
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