Lotr And Star Trek - Page 2

BeardofPants · 09-07-2002, 04:15 PM

That is up to you. Personally, I think it's probable that they had pointy ears as well. Hobbits did. However, we will never know, as Tolkien was not a great believer of describing his characters as a general rule. We'll never know the colour of Leggies hair either! BUT, if you read Tolkien's Letters, you will realise that Tolkien's Quendi are not really based on previous mythology. That in itself is suggestive (and I guess where Nolendil is coming from) that they may not have had pointy ears. By all means, Tolkien focussed on their inner light, and their eyes, rather than their ears... this is what makes Tolkien's Quendi stand out... Not pointy ears. Furthermore, Tolkien's Dwaves are not actually based on RL ones either. I forget the name he wanted to call them - perhaps Nolendil would be able to help out there - but, evidence suggests that Tolkien's Dwarvish mythology was completely different from some of the older ones. Either way, tying it back into the topic question: No, the Vulcan were NOT based on elves. The ear shapes are different; Vulcans are not fair of face, nor speech; Elves pursue art; Vulcans pursue science; Elves strived for preservation; Vulcans were progressive. There are a number of reasons why Vulcans can not have possible been inspired by elves. 'Nuff said

DraztiK · 09-07-2002, 04:47 PM

Tolkien wanted to call the Dwarves the Dwarrows, or even the Dwerrow.

markedel · 09-07-2002, 05:04 PM

The common tongue word is Naugrim, check Appendix F. That's Dwarrow in Westron of course. The Elves too, were not as myth based, I'm not as wel read (I don't own, and haven't done a lot of reading in HoME) but from what I understand Man and Elf are very connected beings, akin in a primeval way, as opposed to spirits from another world, seperate from us. The connection to the Elves as defined below seem to be their "ethreal" nature. Any Elvishness in mankind is obscured, but (in Tolkien's mind anyway) faintly visible, as refrences to men of the present having glimpses into "Faerie" (though I think he would have hated to have it called that).

BeardofPants · 09-07-2002, 05:32 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by DraztiK
Tolkien wanted to call the Dwarves the Dwarrows, or even the Dwerrow.

That's the one I was looking for.... thanks.

cassiopeia · 09-08-2002, 02:26 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by nazgul prince
But when u first read about elves what comes to your mind.If tolkien wanted his elves to be different he should have said so.He should have said that they DON'T have pointed ears.I still say they have pointed ears.It's in elvish thing.

I reckon it would be cool for the elves to have pointed ears and if you think they have pointed ears, thats OK. But Tolkien never said they had pointed ears, thats what I'm trying to say.

Ñólendil · 09-08-2002, 02:51 AM

Quote:

But when u first read about elves what comes to your mind.If tolkien wanted his elves to be different he should have said so.He should have said that they DON'T have pointed ears.I still say they have pointed ears.It's in elvish thing.

Fair enough. Many people agree with you after all, though I don't.

ArwenEvenstar · 09-08-2002, 01:21 PM

i haven't read alot of the HOMEs either. But i've read some other books like the Sil and it dosen't say there that Elves have pointy ears!

and this is a little of topic (sorry) but where do the idea of little elves come from?

Galenavar · 09-08-2002, 03:12 PM

It's all about personal perception. No where does it say that elves have pointed ears, nor does it say it doesn't. So...take your pick! No one can be right or wrong in this case. You could argue all day, but it all boils down to the fact that we don't know for sure, unless someone has an interview with Tolkien where someone asks "Did the elves have pointy ears?" and then his answer. Actually, I'd be willing to bet that his answer would be something along the lines of "How do you picture them?"

The point is, perception and point of view is key. There is no right or wrong. For instance, I always pictured Legolas as greenish skinned. He was from a forest, he registered as green. See what I mean? It's all about point of view.

09-07-2002, 04:15 PM	#21
BeardofPants the Shrike Join Date: Mar 2002 Location: San Francisco, CA <3 Posts: 10,647	That is up to you. Personally, I think it's probable that they had pointy ears as well. Hobbits did. However, we will never know, as Tolkien was not a great believer of describing his characters as a general rule. We'll never know the colour of Leggies hair either! BUT, if you read Tolkien's Letters, you will realise that Tolkien's Quendi are not really based on previous mythology. That in itself is suggestive (and I guess where Nolendil is coming from) that they may not have had pointy ears. By all means, Tolkien focussed on their inner light, and their eyes, rather than their ears... this is what makes Tolkien's Quendi stand out... Not pointy ears. Furthermore, Tolkien's Dwaves are not actually based on RL ones either. I forget the name he wanted to call them - perhaps Nolendil would be able to help out there - but, evidence suggests that Tolkien's Dwarvish mythology was completely different from some of the older ones. Either way, tying it back into the topic question: No, the Vulcan were NOT based on elves. The ear shapes are different; Vulcans are not fair of face, nor speech; Elves pursue art; Vulcans pursue science; Elves strived for preservation; Vulcans were progressive. There are a number of reasons why Vulcans can not have possible been inspired by elves. 'Nuff said __________________ "Binary solo! 0000001! 00000011! 0000001! 00000011!" ~ The Humans are Dead, Flight of the Conchords

09-07-2002, 04:47 PM	#22
DraztiK Enting Join Date: Aug 2002 Location: Mol, Belgium Posts: 94	Tolkien wanted to call the Dwarves the Dwarrows, or even the Dwerrow. __________________ The name's DraztiK, but those whose name isn't totally blasted into Oblivion yet may call me DraZ... * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * Our Armies in England, Ireland, Scotland and Wales Our Brothers in Belgium, Holland and France will not fail. Denmark, Sweden, Norway, Finland, Italy, Switzerland, Austria, back to the Glory of Germany! ~Manowar - Blood of the Kings~

09-07-2002, 05:04 PM	#23
markedel 'Sober' Mullet Frosh Join Date: Jan 2002 Location: Queen's Posts: 1,245	The common tongue word is Naugrim, check Appendix F. That's Dwarrow in Westron of course. The Elves too, were not as myth based, I'm not as wel read (I don't own, and haven't done a lot of reading in HoME) but from what I understand Man and Elf are very connected beings, akin in a primeval way, as opposed to spirits from another world, seperate from us. The connection to the Elves as defined below seem to be their "ethreal" nature. Any Elvishness in mankind is obscured, but (in Tolkien's mind anyway) faintly visible, as refrences to men of the present having glimpses into "Faerie" (though I think he would have hated to have it called that). __________________ "Earnur was a man like his father in valour, but not in wisdom"

09-08-2002, 01:21 PM	#27
ArwenEvenstar Elf Lord Join Date: Sep 2001 Location: and why do YOU want to know? Posts: 685	i haven't read alot of the HOMEs either. But i've read some other books like the Sil and it dosen't say there that Elves have pointy ears! and this is a little of topic (sorry) but where do the idea of little elves come from? __________________ The only thing active about me is my imagination!

09-08-2002, 03:12 PM	#28
Galenavar Elven Warrior Join Date: Jul 2002 Location: WI Posts: 129	It's all about personal perception. No where does it say that elves have pointed ears, nor does it say it doesn't. So...take your pick! No one can be right or wrong in this case. You could argue all day, but it all boils down to the fact that we don't know for sure, unless someone has an interview with Tolkien where someone asks "Did the elves have pointy ears?" and then his answer. Actually, I'd be willing to bet that his answer would be something along the lines of "How do you picture them?" The point is, perception and point of view is key. There is no right or wrong. For instance, I always pictured Legolas as greenish skinned. He was from a forest, he registered as green. See what I mean? It's all about point of view. __________________ Galenavar Elen sila lumenn' omentielvo If there's no magic, there's no meaning.

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