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#81 | |
Banned
Join Date: Feb 2003
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#82 |
Banned
Join Date: Feb 2003
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My last dog (she's dead now) caught a cat that had mistakenly intruded into my back yard once. She didn't kill it with a quick nip to the back of the neck. She bit it on the back of the neck and then shook it while it cried out in pain... I heard it all the way upstairs, but I didn't get to it in time to save it. Giz had broken it's neck and it laid helpless on the ground until fluid seemed out of it's ears and it died. Probably it's brain swelled from the shaking. It was pretty guesome.
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#83 | ||
Banned
Join Date: Feb 2003
Location: I have no idea.
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#84 | ||
The Chocoholic Sea Elf Administrator
Join Date: Jan 2002
Location: N?n in Eilph (Belgium)
Posts: 14,363
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Humanity, you've let me down once more. But I'm getting used to it by now. Why, oh why don't you even try to at least act civilised? Quote:
To kill a quarry with a simple bite in the back of the neck requires much skill, practise and a very strong jaw. If I'm not mistaken, not many predators can even do that. Most large felines choke their prey to death. I'm not saying you won't be able to train a dog to kill the fox like that but I doubt most hunting hounds have had that special training. Nor do I deem it logical that a pack of hounds, trained to hunt, track and kill, would stand back and let one dog do the clean kill without interference of guidance from a human handler.
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#85 |
The Insufferable
Join Date: Aug 2001
Posts: 3,333
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Actually, it was at least my understanding that most natural predators in the wild kill as stated before- with an efficient bite to the back of the neck.
However, this is a learned behavior (animals are taught, generally by their mother) and the domesticated breeds have somehow lost the knack. Which is why dogs shake and tear animals, and why cats often 'play' with their food- it's because they've caught the darn thing but don't know how to kill it.
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#86 |
The Chocoholic Sea Elf Administrator
Join Date: Jan 2002
Location: N?n in Eilph (Belgium)
Posts: 14,363
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You could be right, Wayfarer. But all large predators I can think of right now seem to choke their prey. I can only seem remember tigers to break necks. Still, I could be wrong though.
On cats, I believe their playing with preys is also deemed as practise for their reflexes and speed.
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#87 |
Banned
Join Date: Feb 2003
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Dogs hunt in packs. They all participate in the kill. That's part of their instinct.
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#88 | |
Elf Lord
Join Date: Sep 2003
Location: In me taters
Posts: 3,288
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A few comments: foxes are not a pest in the UK. Even if they were, it woud make much more sense to use a gun than a pack of hounds and braying Hooray Henries who actually catch the fox less than half the time. So, "pest control" is a specious defense. Also, I completely distrust the claim that banning foxhunting would ruin the rural economy. You can hardly class it as a productive economic activity in its own right (unless there's some black market I've never heard of where you can flog your dead fox for 50 grand): people do it (and pay for its upkeep) because they like doing it, like yachting. Why not carry on riding, even with packs of dogs, but without the killing? That said, I agree that it's a bit odd that just because foxes are fluffy (and a bit like dogs) we seem to think that they have more rights than, say, pheasants or salmon, which are killed for fun by all sorts of people on a daily basis. So, why are foxes special? Should we ban fishing too? Is there a thing about the "skills of the hunter" that we, as humans, should be able to practice? |
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#89 |
An enigma in a conundrum
Join Date: Oct 1999
Posts: 6,476
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Here the have organized fox hunts in late September, early October, however, they don't kill or injure the animal merely find it.
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#90 | |
Death of Mooters and [Entmoot] Internal Affairs
Join Date: Oct 2002
Location: Oslo, Norway
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#91 |
An enigma in a conundrum
Join Date: Oct 1999
Posts: 6,476
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Did you ever think that when a fish is caught, it's like an alien abduction?
If you throw him back he'll say "I saw a bright light and was lifted up and then there were these strange looking creatures". ![]()
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Vizzini: "HE DIDN'T FALL?! INCONCEIVABLE!!" Inigo: "You keep using that word. I do not think it means what you think it means." |
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#92 |
Greatest Elven woman of Aman
Join Date: Aug 2002
Location: Having way too much fun with Fëanor's 7
Posts: 4,285
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We do eat the fish, don't we? Hunting and fishing is fine with me, as long as the meat is utilised.
About the way of killing: I do not believe natural predators always use a clean and fast way of killing its prey. Nature can be 'cruel'. There's no reason why a predator should be concerned about their prey being killed fast, other than preventing it to escape, which often can be achieved in other ways than instant killing. But that doesn't mean we as humans shouldn't strive to kill our preys as effective as possible.
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#93 | |
Elven Warrior
Join Date: Jun 2003
Location: on the boats
Posts: 264
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Quote:
![]() But seriously, I REALLY can't understand why all these people who like foxhunting can't get the same pleasures from drag-hunting. If the rural economy is a problem - well, drag-hunting surely solves that too, because it needs hounds and people to look after them. For pheasants and salmon and the like, well, I'm afraid I'm not terribly happy about blood sports in general. The only thing I think is acceptable is if one is shooting, and can guarantee a clean kill. But otherwise ... well, clay pigeon shooting could be a substitute for pheasants, surely, though I assume we'd have to come up with something else to satisfy the salmon hunters. How's about maybe, two salmon-hunters, one on either bank, with their hooks entangled ... they could play one another, and may the better one win and not get the ducking ![]() For fox hunting and fishing though, this does bring up another issue and that is that keen anglers are very wary about moves to ban fox hunting, because they think their sport will come next for a ban. They try to claim that it's thanks to them that many stretches of waterway are well cared for and preserved. I suppose my answer to that one is - well, come and help preserve our canals ... and recover the ones that have been lost! |
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#94 |
An enigma in a conundrum
Join Date: Oct 1999
Posts: 6,476
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gee, makes me think I should go hunt radishes
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Vizzini: "HE DIDN'T FALL?! INCONCEIVABLE!!" Inigo: "You keep using that word. I do not think it means what you think it means." |
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#95 |
An enigma in a conundrum
Join Date: Oct 1999
Posts: 6,476
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ok, before I get jumped on, I only troll the frozen food section of my local supermarkets and occasionally hunt in the meat counter.
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Vizzini: "HE DIDN'T FALL?! INCONCEIVABLE!!" Inigo: "You keep using that word. I do not think it means what you think it means." |
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#96 |
Elf Lord
Join Date: Sep 2003
Location: In me taters
Posts: 3,288
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He he. I like the idea of an alien-abduction fish. I bet all the other fish slag it off and say "yea, yea, pull the other one".
An animal is, I would guess, indifferent to whether it is killed for dinner, for population control or for fun. The difference would be OUR morality. I can see that you could argue that fishing is an ancient skill which can be used to catch your dinner, and lots of anglers do eat what they catch, or put it back. (Though this reminds me of that scene in Restaurant at the End of the Universe where the cows can speak and have been bred to want to be eaten by the diners. "Let's meet the meat.") I agree re: drag-hunting Hemel. |
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#97 |
An enigma in a conundrum
Join Date: Oct 1999
Posts: 6,476
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....oh and my towel is in the wash, drat.
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Vizzini: "HE DIDN'T FALL?! INCONCEIVABLE!!" Inigo: "You keep using that word. I do not think it means what you think it means." |
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#98 | |
Corruptor
Join Date: Jan 2003
Location: Jozi SA
Posts: 1,885
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#99 | |
I am Freddie/UNDERCOVER/ Founder of The Great Continent of Entmoot
Join Date: Dec 2001
Location: Plainsboro, NJ
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Come back! Come back! To Mordor we will take you! "The only thing better than a great plan is implementing a great plan" - JerseyDevil "If everyone agreed with me all the time, everything would be just fine"- JerseyDevil AboutNewJersey.com New Jersey MessageBoard Another Tolkien Forum Memorial to the Twin Towers New Jersey Map Fellowship of the Messageboard Legend of the Jersey Devil Support New Jersey's Liberty Tower Peacefire.org AboutNewJersey.com - New Jersey Travel and Tourism Guide |
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#100 |
An enigma in a conundrum
Join Date: Oct 1999
Posts: 6,476
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I agree with J.D. as long as you stay away from Newark the state is quite nice (oh and the refineries)
![]() Besides, Texas is a whole country unto itself and you'll never see it all.
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