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#21 |
The Insufferable
Join Date: Aug 2001
Posts: 3,333
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Re: The palintirs.
They were originally placed in the following locations: 1) Osgiliath 2) Minas Ithil 3) Minas Anor 4) Orthanc 5) Annúminas(Fornost) 6) Amon Sul (Weathertop) 7) The White Towers The stones at Annuminas, Amon Sul, and the White Towers were taken by Ardevui on his ill-fated voyage, and ended up at the bottom of the sea. The tower that housed the stone in Osgiliath was razed during the kinslaying, leaving only the stones at Minas Ithil, Minas Anorm and Orthanc, whose fates you know of. :P
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Disgraced he may be, yet is not dethroned, and keeps the rags of lordship once he owned |
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#22 | |
High King of Númenórë
Join Date: Jan 2003
Location: Númenórë <--United States of America
Posts: 1,947
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Quote:
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'Et Eärello Endorenna utúlien. Sinome maruvan ar Hildinyar tenn' Ambar-metta!' - And those were the words that Elendil spoke when he came up out of the Sea on the wings of the wind: 'Out of the Great Sea to Middle-earth I am come. In this place will I abide, and my heirs, unto the ending of the world.' 'Then Tuor arrayed himself in the hauberk, and set the helm upon his head, and he girt himself with the sword; black were sheath and belt with clasps of silver. Thus armed he went forth from Turgon's hall, and stood upon the high terraces of Taras in the red light of the sun. None were there to see him, as he gazed westward, gleaming in silver and gold, and he knew not that in that hour he appeared as one of the Mighty of the West, and fit to be father of the kings of the Kings of Men beyond the Sea, as it was indeed his doom to be; but in the taking of those arms a change came upon Tuor son of Huor, and his heart grew great within him. And as he stepped down from the doors the swans did him reverence, and plucking each a great feather from their wings they proffered them to him, laying their long necks upon the stone before his feet; and he took the seven feathers and set them in the crest of his helm, and straightway the swans arose and flew north in the sunset, and Tuor saw them no more.' -Of Tuor and his Coming to Gondolin "Oh. Forgive me, fairest of all males of Entmoot...Back down, all ye other wannabe fairest males! Dunedain is the fairest!" --Linaewen ![]() |
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#23 |
The Insufferable
Join Date: Aug 2001
Posts: 3,333
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The white towers were west of the shire and east of the grey havens.
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Disgraced he may be, yet is not dethroned, and keeps the rags of lordship once he owned |
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#24 | |
High King of Númenórë
Join Date: Jan 2003
Location: Númenórë <--United States of America
Posts: 1,947
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I don't think Sauron's finger was ever reformed, because in The Two Towers Gollum makes this statement:
Quote:
It could go either way. I tried looking for another passage I just read this past week, but I am too lazy to continue looking for it, hehe ![]()
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'Et Eärello Endorenna utúlien. Sinome maruvan ar Hildinyar tenn' Ambar-metta!' - And those were the words that Elendil spoke when he came up out of the Sea on the wings of the wind: 'Out of the Great Sea to Middle-earth I am come. In this place will I abide, and my heirs, unto the ending of the world.' 'Then Tuor arrayed himself in the hauberk, and set the helm upon his head, and he girt himself with the sword; black were sheath and belt with clasps of silver. Thus armed he went forth from Turgon's hall, and stood upon the high terraces of Taras in the red light of the sun. None were there to see him, as he gazed westward, gleaming in silver and gold, and he knew not that in that hour he appeared as one of the Mighty of the West, and fit to be father of the kings of the Kings of Men beyond the Sea, as it was indeed his doom to be; but in the taking of those arms a change came upon Tuor son of Huor, and his heart grew great within him. And as he stepped down from the doors the swans did him reverence, and plucking each a great feather from their wings they proffered them to him, laying their long necks upon the stone before his feet; and he took the seven feathers and set them in the crest of his helm, and straightway the swans arose and flew north in the sunset, and Tuor saw them no more.' -Of Tuor and his Coming to Gondolin "Oh. Forgive me, fairest of all males of Entmoot...Back down, all ye other wannabe fairest males! Dunedain is the fairest!" --Linaewen ![]() |
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#25 |
Lurker
Join Date: Feb 2002
Location: Lothlórien
Posts: 3,419
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Assuming he had other fingers he could wear it on those.
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There's antimony, arsenic, aluminum, selenium... |
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#26 | |
Orodruin's Flame
Join Date: Jan 2004
Location: Kananaskis, AB
Posts: 1,194
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Quote:
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Council of Entmoot - Foreign Affairs Minister - 2004-05 Visit the Ye Olde Avatar Shop and The New One Dont tell me what I cannot do Two men are on a Island, they both see a "monster", one sees a bright light, and the other sees a dark cloud My name bares no reference to the music artist. |
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#27 |
The Chocoholic Sea Elf Administrator
Join Date: Jan 2002
Location: N?n in Eilph (Belgium)
Posts: 14,363
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Or fell in the river.
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We are not things. |
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#28 |
Orodruin's Flame
Join Date: Jan 2004
Location: Kananaskis, AB
Posts: 1,194
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and no picked it out? lol. It must of been worth a furrtune to everyone.
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Council of Entmoot - Foreign Affairs Minister - 2004-05 Visit the Ye Olde Avatar Shop and The New One Dont tell me what I cannot do Two men are on a Island, they both see a "monster", one sees a bright light, and the other sees a dark cloud My name bares no reference to the music artist. |
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#29 |
The Chocoholic Sea Elf Administrator
Join Date: Jan 2002
Location: N?n in Eilph (Belgium)
Posts: 14,363
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Well it is the Great River Anduin. I doubt you'd be able to relocate it and dive it up again.
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We are not things. |
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#30 |
Orodruin's Flame
Join Date: Jan 2004
Location: Kananaskis, AB
Posts: 1,194
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still. get a water creature to get it or something.
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Council of Entmoot - Foreign Affairs Minister - 2004-05 Visit the Ye Olde Avatar Shop and The New One Dont tell me what I cannot do Two men are on a Island, they both see a "monster", one sees a bright light, and the other sees a dark cloud My name bares no reference to the music artist. |
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#31 |
Lurker
Join Date: Feb 2002
Location: Lothlórien
Posts: 3,419
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And how do you propose to get a fish to bring you up a heavy stone orb that crackles with the power of people seeing out of it? But this is deeply off-topic... a new thread perhaps?
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There's antimony, arsenic, aluminum, selenium... |
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#32 |
Elven Warrior
Join Date: Jan 2004
Location: The Lonely Mountain
Posts: 161
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Dúnedain - I understand it to be #2; Sauron was never able to reform his missing finger.
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"Evil will always triumph because good is dumb." - Spaceballs |
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#33 | |
The Insufferable
Join Date: Aug 2001
Posts: 3,333
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Quote:
Here's a question for you all- I take a ball of glass somewhere between two and three feet in diameter and toss it into the Mississippi, are /you/ going to be able to 'just fish it out'. Now, if that /still/ seems too easy, /this/ river has nary a single dam on it, so the flow of water is going to be tremendous, enough to wash the palintir out to sea rather quickly, the object you're searching for lies amid countless debris and rubble, it probably can't be located by sight in the murky water and, oh, lest I forget to mention, you're trying to do all this at the single most contested spot in the height of a civil war. Have fun. ![]()
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Disgraced he may be, yet is not dethroned, and keeps the rags of lordship once he owned |
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#34 |
Lurker
Join Date: Feb 2002
Location: Lothlórien
Posts: 3,419
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*starts diving for lost PalantÃ*r*
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There's antimony, arsenic, aluminum, selenium... |
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#35 |
Orodruin's Flame
Join Date: Jan 2004
Location: Kananaskis, AB
Posts: 1,194
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ANYWAYS... back to the topic maybe...
Talking about the ring, where was it i heard that 'if the ring makes you go invisible when you put it on, why doesnt it make the chain go invisible around frodo's neck?' lol
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Council of Entmoot - Foreign Affairs Minister - 2004-05 Visit the Ye Olde Avatar Shop and The New One Dont tell me what I cannot do Two men are on a Island, they both see a "monster", one sees a bright light, and the other sees a dark cloud My name bares no reference to the music artist. |
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#36 |
The Insufferable
Join Date: Aug 2001
Posts: 3,333
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Because the chain is just matter, and the ring didn't work on a purely physical level.
What the ring did, in making a mortal invisible, was push them partially into the spirit or wraith world, so that they couldn't be seen but could still interact. This is also why, for example, Frodo's vision was dark and blurred while he wore the ring.
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Disgraced he may be, yet is not dethroned, and keeps the rags of lordship once he owned |
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#37 |
Elf Lord
Join Date: Dec 2003
Location: USA until I find a way to get to Middle Earth
Posts: 681
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I haven't read everything here, so I may be repeating something, but this is how I imagined Sauron when I thought about it: Someone with a human-like body (Gollum said something about him having 9 fingers, I think) but who had a very unusual eye. There has to be something about the eye, because it is mentioned several times, and even seen in Galadriel's mirror.
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"...but I love not the bright sword for its sharpness, nor the arrow for its swiftness, nor the warrior for his glory. I love only that which they defend: the city of the Men of Numenor." "'I would,' said Faramir. And he took her in his arms and kissed her under the sunlit sky, and he cared not that they stood high upon the walls in the sight of many. And many indeed saw them and the light that shone about them as they came down from the walls and went hand in hand to the Houses of Healing." |
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#38 |
Swan-Knight of Dol Amroth
Join Date: Dec 2002
Location: On the Bay of Belfalas
Posts: 1,125
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I have always taken it that Sauron had furnished Barad-dûr with some sort of magical device akin to seat on the Hill of Seeing, Amon Hen, that he used to survey Middle-earth. Obviously he had physical eyes that he formed with his new body, but he lost the ability to look any way he wanted with the downfall of Númenór, whether he had the Ring or not. Oh, and I think the reason so many people think that the Lidless Eye, which I take to be a metaphor for eternal vigilance, not deformity, was red, is that the Orcs of Barad-dûr wore that symbol in red.
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"What song the Sirens sang, or what name Achilles assumed when he hid himself among women, though puzzling questions are not beyond conjecture." - Sir Thomas Browne, Urn Burial. |
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#39 | |
Elf Lord
Join Date: Dec 2003
Location: USA until I find a way to get to Middle Earth
Posts: 681
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Quote:
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"...but I love not the bright sword for its sharpness, nor the arrow for its swiftness, nor the warrior for his glory. I love only that which they defend: the city of the Men of Numenor." "'I would,' said Faramir. And he took her in his arms and kissed her under the sunlit sky, and he cared not that they stood high upon the walls in the sight of many. And many indeed saw them and the light that shone about them as they came down from the walls and went hand in hand to the Houses of Healing." |
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#40 | |||||
Enting
Join Date: Feb 2003
Location: Valinor
Posts: 76
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The red also could've come from this, when Denethor shows his palantir to Gandalf.
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As stated, the Ithil Stone was taken by Sauron in taking over that tower and lost in the destruction of Barad-dur; the stones at Orthanc and Minas Tirith were left in the ownership of Arvedui's heir, Aragorn; and the stone at Osgiliath was lost. The seventh stone whose fate has not been correctly stated here was Elendil's Stone of Elostirion, the tallest of the towers of Emyn Beraid that Gil-galad built for Elendil (referred to as The White Towers above). This was a special stone, for it only looked West to the Sea and could not be used for communication the way the other stones were. Elendil used it to look West over the Sea: Quote:
Some posts make it sound questionable that Sauron had a physical figure still. He did, as Tolkien states in Letter 246: Quote:
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'Legolas' on The Barrow-Downs ...take counsel with thyself, and remember who and what thou art. Last edited by Ulmo : 01-16-2004 at 03:27 PM. |
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