07-15-2011, 10:16 AM | #281 |
Elf Lord
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May the FSM bless this true believer with a touch of His Noodly Appendage
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Glendower: I can call spirits from the vasty deep. Hotspur: Why, so can I, or so can any man; But will they come when you do call for them? "I like pigs. Dogs look up to us, cats look down on us, but pigs treat us as equals."- Winston Churchill |
07-18-2011, 06:03 PM | #282 |
the Shrike
Join Date: Mar 2002
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Ramen.
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"Binary solo! 0000001! 00000011! 0000001! 00000011!" ~ The Humans are Dead, Flight of the Conchords |
02-22-2012, 02:34 PM | #283 |
Quasi Evil
Join Date: Jan 2003
Location: Maryland, US
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Dear Catholics,
Is Rick Santorum seen as anything other than a frightening joke as a presidential candidate within the Catholic community as he is by most people outside of it? Honestly... Enough with the Hitler and Nazi comparisons...
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"People's political beliefs don't stem from the factual information they've acquired. Far more the facts people choose to believe are the product of their political beliefs." "Injustice anywhere is a threat to justice everywhere." |
02-24-2012, 09:43 PM | #284 |
Elf Lord
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Rick is free to run.
Just be glad that Nancy Pelosi and Kathy Sabelius aren't running. They have Obama to front for them. Then again, Sabelius is making her interpretation of what was written "law" and she's appointed not elected. So, your point was........
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Inked "Aslan is not a tame lion." CSL/LWW "The new school [acts] as if it required...courage to say a blasphemy. There is only one thing that requires real courage to say, and that is a truism." GK Chesterton "And there is always the danger of allowing people to suppose that our modern times are so wholly unlike any other times that the fundamental facts about man's nature have wholly changed with changing circumstances." Dorothy L. Sayers, 1 Sept. 1941 |
02-24-2012, 10:37 PM | #285 | |
Elf Lord
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Quote:
"Stop Talking About the ‘Catholic Vote’! It Doesn’t Exist" http://www.tnr.com/article/the-perma...c-constituency
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Glendower: I can call spirits from the vasty deep. Hotspur: Why, so can I, or so can any man; But will they come when you do call for them? "I like pigs. Dogs look up to us, cats look down on us, but pigs treat us as equals."- Winston Churchill |
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02-25-2012, 09:33 AM | #286 | |
Deus Ex Machina
Join Date: Mar 2002
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Quote:
I can tell you that among the practicing/lapsed Catholics in my immediate area: having grown up trying to feed families of 9+ people on a can of spam makes birth control pretty popular, one of the few good priests I know is gay, and the Church has yet to rebuild its credibility in wake of all the child molestation scandals. American Catholics right now have some very good reasons to be skeptical of anything the Bishops are supporting, including Santorum's style of conservatism. That said, there are also suburban Catholic mega churches whose parishioners are likely to trend more conservative republican and more likely to see Santorum as a candidate they agree with on moral values.
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"5. Plain Rings with RUNES on the inside. Avoid these like the PLAGUE.-Diana Wynne Jones Tough Guide To FantasyLand ...it's not much of a show if somebody doesn't suffer, and preferably at length. Suffering is beautiful in any case, and so is anguish; but as for loathing, and bitterness... I don't think they belong on the stage at all. - Isabella, I Gelosi Last edited by Willow Oran : 02-25-2012 at 07:10 PM. |
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02-25-2012, 08:31 PM | #287 | |
Elf Lord
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Yea, these are the people I'd rely on as moral authorities...
Feb 25, 2012: Quote:
Apparently lying to a grand jury about covering up child rape qualifies you to lecture other people about their sex lives.
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Glendower: I can call spirits from the vasty deep. Hotspur: Why, so can I, or so can any man; But will they come when you do call for them? "I like pigs. Dogs look up to us, cats look down on us, but pigs treat us as equals."- Winston Churchill Last edited by GrayMouser : 02-25-2012 at 08:33 PM. |
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02-26-2012, 03:55 PM | #288 |
Dread Mothy Lord and Halfwitted Apprentice Loremaster
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Willow has the right of it. I do know some extreme conservative Catholics who support Santorum. The slightly-less-extreme conservative ones tend to favour Newt. And, of course, you get the ones who support Paul, either because they agree with his basic libertarian bent (which is obviously out of keeping with most Catholic ways of thinking), or because he seems to them to be the only one running who may, in fact, be human. More credible, but the Canada Party still sums up my view of Ron Paul pretty well.
Wow, GM, I hadn't heard that. With Rigali, too, Philadelphia seems to be doing particularly poorly in this department.
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Crux fidelis, inter omnes arbor una nobilis. Nulla talem silva profert, fronde, flore, germine. Dulce lignum, dulce clavo, dulce pondus sustinens. 'With a melon?' - Eric Idle Last edited by Gwaimir Windgem : 02-26-2012 at 04:36 PM. |
02-26-2012, 06:26 PM | #289 |
Elf Lord
Join Date: Sep 2003
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There must be Catholics who are Democrats too, no?
Over here, the "Catholic vote", if there is one (and I am not sure there is) would tend to be left-leaning rather than right. |
02-26-2012, 08:20 PM | #290 |
High King at Annuminas Administrator
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I'm not Catholic, but I live in Chicago - and trust me - there are many Catholics who are Democrats!
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My Fanfic: Letters of Firiel Tales of Nolduryon Visitors Come to Court Ñ á ë ?* ó ú é ä ï ö Ö ñ É Þ ð ß ® ™ [Xurl=Xhttp://entmoot.tolkientrail.com/showthread.php?s=&postid=ABCXYZ#postABCXYZ]text[/Xurl] Splitting Threads is SUCH Hard Work!! |
02-26-2012, 08:36 PM | #291 | |
Deus Ex Machina
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Quote:
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"5. Plain Rings with RUNES on the inside. Avoid these like the PLAGUE.-Diana Wynne Jones Tough Guide To FantasyLand ...it's not much of a show if somebody doesn't suffer, and preferably at length. Suffering is beautiful in any case, and so is anguish; but as for loathing, and bitterness... I don't think they belong on the stage at all. - Isabella, I Gelosi Last edited by Willow Oran : 02-26-2012 at 08:45 PM. |
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02-26-2012, 08:57 PM | #292 |
Dread Mothy Lord and Halfwitted Apprentice Loremaster
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Yeah, Catholics have traditionally been very, very Democrat. Time was, you would get priests saying it was a mortal sin to vote Republican. Today, the Democrat party is itself a very different entity than it once was, and the Catholic Church in the US tends to be more allied with conservative figures, although this is of course a generalization. Roughly speaking, the ideology of the US bishops tends to be "socially conservative, liberal on fiscal and immigration issues," but the social conservatism is much more pronounced in the US Church than in much of the Catholic Church. And, yes, there are still plenty of Catholic Democrats. About a month ago, I finally got sick enough of both parties that I registered independent, but before that, I was a Democrat, and I still believe that there is deeper resonance between Democrat and Catholic thought than there is between Republican and Catholic thought.
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Crux fidelis, inter omnes arbor una nobilis. Nulla talem silva profert, fronde, flore, germine. Dulce lignum, dulce clavo, dulce pondus sustinens. 'With a melon?' - Eric Idle |
02-27-2012, 02:44 PM | #293 |
Quasi Evil
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Thanks for the clarification. I was basically aware that there were more than one type of catholic (and more than one type of catholic approach to politics) but I have been so floored by watching Santorum supporters on TV saying "well WE CATHOLICS agree with Santorum on everything because he stands for X and Y and Z" right after he talks about how all nurses are Hitler or some such nonsense. Guess I have yet to hear someone say "hey Im Catholic and this guy is nuts!"
As for it making more sense for Catholics to be Democrats, frankly it seems quite clear to me that traditional Christian philosophies are much more liberal (and radical) than they are conservative and Ive never really understood how true Christians can say without any hint of irony that the Republican party is the party for Christians.
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"People's political beliefs don't stem from the factual information they've acquired. Far more the facts people choose to believe are the product of their political beliefs." "Injustice anywhere is a threat to justice everywhere." |
02-27-2012, 03:37 PM | #294 | |
Elf Lord
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Quote:
* runs away * |
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02-28-2012, 12:06 AM | #295 |
High King at Annuminas Administrator
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Well actually... it's tough. I don't know if this is so in European politics, but in America, so many are Christian - of one stripe or another - or at least we could say that the Christian heritage is so prevalent, that...
My theory is that the two major political parties in the US divide aspects of Christianity among themselves. A few decades ago, many more Christians would have identified with the Democratic Party, I think. That began to change with Roe v Wade, the ensuing support of abortion rights by the Democratic Party, and the appearance on the scene of Ronald Reagan - a Republican who was so strongly pro-life. I think it was that issue alone which pulled many Christians over to the Republican Party.
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My Fanfic: Letters of Firiel Tales of Nolduryon Visitors Come to Court Ñ á ë ?* ó ú é ä ï ö Ö ñ É Þ ð ß ® ™ [Xurl=Xhttp://entmoot.tolkientrail.com/showthread.php?s=&postid=ABCXYZ#postABCXYZ]text[/Xurl] Splitting Threads is SUCH Hard Work!! |
02-28-2012, 07:48 AM | #296 |
Elf Lord
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I think you are dead right Valandil, and I appreciate you addressing the issue when I was clearly teasing. As I recall, it was Reagan that really tapped into the "moral majority", to the Republicans' lasting electoral benefit.
If this is predicated on some key issues, such as opposition to abortion and gay rights, what do you think the implications are for the future? Two terms of Reagan, plus three of various Bushes have brought several wars but not a ban on abortion. And now we've got states legalising gay marraige, in some form or another. It looks like the majority is turning away from the conservative moral agenda. Can the Republicans continue to face both ways at once? I can't speak for "Europe", but in the UK religion is far less political. Issues such as abortion, euthanasia and the death penalty are usually categorised as issues of conscience, and therefore not party-political. Politicians who start banging on about them are usually mistrusted. In Scotland, there are close links between the Catholic Church and the Labour Party. On a personal level, having been brought up in a strongly Protestant household it's my view that Christian moral views far more closely align with the Left (forgive thy tresspassers) than the Right (an eye for an eye). It is relatively eash for the rich to talk about banning abortion. If Little Princess gets up the duff you can be sure Daddy will buy in the best illegal docs, or fly her first class to an offshore facility. So it's easy for them to promote abortion as a rallying flag because it doesn't have any consequences for them. Much harder to address the inequality, poverty and suffering throughout the world, which might require them to give up one of their yachts. |
03-04-2012, 06:45 AM | #297 | |
Elf Lord
Join Date: Feb 2003
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Quote:
__________________
Glendower: I can call spirits from the vasty deep. Hotspur: Why, so can I, or so can any man; But will they come when you do call for them? "I like pigs. Dogs look up to us, cats look down on us, but pigs treat us as equals."- Winston Churchill |
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03-04-2012, 07:43 AM | #298 | ||
Elf Lord
Join Date: Feb 2003
Location: Ilha Formosa
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Quote:
On abortion, there's basically been no change in 40 years- a small majority accepts it, but also is favorable to limits on some issues- late-term abortions are much less acceptable, and there are objections to abortions seen as birth control. Young people have about the same opinions as their elders. The Republicans have made this such an issue that they'll be bound to appoint anti-abortion Supreme Court justices; but if Roe v. Wade is overturned entirely I think they'll face a huge backlash. Quote:
Ironically, Santorum doesn't even draw the support of a majority of Republican Catholics, who support Romney by a small plurality. His base is with Protestant Fundamentalists- the very people who insisted Kennedy make his "seperation" speech. At one point, Santorum cited a Texas case where it was ruled that prayers couldn't be delivered over the loudspeakers before a high-school football game. Ironically, the case against the school was brought by Catholic and Mormon parents who objected to their children being proselytised by the school administration, which was heavily Fundamentalist.
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Glendower: I can call spirits from the vasty deep. Hotspur: Why, so can I, or so can any man; But will they come when you do call for them? "I like pigs. Dogs look up to us, cats look down on us, but pigs treat us as equals."- Winston Churchill |
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03-08-2012, 05:09 AM | #299 | |
Elf Lord
Join Date: Feb 2003
Location: Ilha Formosa
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Another case of oppressive secular governmant violating rights of religious employees!!!
Quote:
Along with the rights of employers to restrict employees from obtaining health care they don't like, town clerks refusing to do their jobs and perform marriages for gays, government-licensed pharmacists refusing to supply medicine they don't approve of, Muslim cab-drivers refusing to carry alcohol, I support the right of mail carriers to refuse to distribute mail that they don't like. All for religious reasons, of course.
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Glendower: I can call spirits from the vasty deep. Hotspur: Why, so can I, or so can any man; But will they come when you do call for them? "I like pigs. Dogs look up to us, cats look down on us, but pigs treat us as equals."- Winston Churchill |
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03-12-2012, 06:28 PM | #300 |
Elf Lord
Join Date: Oct 2004
Location: sikeston, MO, usa, earth, sol
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Ah, yes, its all those evil religious types and the governments are pure as the driven globally warmed liquid water, eh?
http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/reli...overnment.html "Lawyers for the two women claim that the Government is setting the bar too high and that “manifesting” religion includes doing things that are not a “requirement of the faith”, and that they are therefore protected by human rights. They say that Christians are given less protection than members of other religions who have been granted special status for garments or symbols such as the Sikh turban and kara bracelet, or the Muslim hijab. Last year it emerged that Mrs Eweida, a British Airways worker, and Mrs Chaplin, a nurse, had taken their fight to the European Court in Strasbourg after both faced disciplinary action for wearing a cross at work." Oi, vey!
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Inked "Aslan is not a tame lion." CSL/LWW "The new school [acts] as if it required...courage to say a blasphemy. There is only one thing that requires real courage to say, and that is a truism." GK Chesterton "And there is always the danger of allowing people to suppose that our modern times are so wholly unlike any other times that the fundamental facts about man's nature have wholly changed with changing circumstances." Dorothy L. Sayers, 1 Sept. 1941 |
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