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#1 |
Enting
Join Date: Feb 2002
Location: New England
Posts: 59
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Arwen is Xenaelf?
I havent spent much time here in awhile but it seems like the dialog has gotten a bit shrill over them thar Jackson movies. One aspect of the film that seems to have been heavily criticized was Arwen spiriting off Frodo on Asfaloth across the ford. Apparently Arwen drawing a sword which she never actually uses has turned her into a serialized syndicated musclebound action hero. I'm not exactly sure why this characterization has gained acceptance among those who dislike the film. Drawing a sword in defiance has ruined her character? I think those who have adopted this characterization should educate themselves a bit more on Arwen's lineage if they believe this is an inexcusable bit of create License-before they start referring to Luthien as Red Sonya.
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#2 | |
I am Freddie/UNDERCOVER/ Founder of The Great Continent of Entmoot
Join Date: Dec 2001
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Re: Arwen is Xenaelf?
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#3 |
Lurker
Join Date: Feb 2002
Location: Lothlórien
Posts: 3,419
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Yes. Disabling Frodo from drawing a sword in defence was the problem with that scene.
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#4 |
Elven Warrior
Join Date: Nov 2003
Posts: 345
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we should feel grateful, none of us really knew how close Jackson came to the sword fighting she elf. pretty close. infact too close for comfort.
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#5 |
Slacker
Warrior Admin Join Date: Mar 2002
Location: Alabama
Posts: 2,759
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Actually, we probably helped keep her away from Helm's Deep. PJ said that they were influenced by the immense amount of public outcry from the internet, and I'm sure a fair share came from this board.
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#6 |
Elven Warrior
Join Date: Nov 2003
Posts: 345
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And I'm expecting her to read the "arwen is xenaelf" thread, cry again, and then refuse to be a role in "the hobbit"
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#7 | |
Master of Orchestration President Emeritus of Entmoot 2004-2008
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Quote:
we dont want arwen in the hobbit now do we?
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#8 | |
I am Freddie/UNDERCOVER/ Founder of The Great Continent of Entmoot
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#9 |
Enting
Join Date: Feb 2002
Location: New England
Posts: 59
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It sure is easier to say I dont get it when you dont even address the topic. I will be sure to deconstruct that scene later and you can rant on without making any good points then. Whether or not the scene was ruined due to Arwen's role was not the topic. The question was the ridiculous term Xenaelf that has been thrown around entirely innapropriately. I would welcome someone actually attempting to defend it.
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#10 | ||
I am Freddie/UNDERCOVER/ Founder of The Great Continent of Entmoot
Join Date: Dec 2001
Location: Plainsboro, NJ
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#11 |
Enting
Join Date: Feb 2002
Location: New England
Posts: 59
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so your basing this characterization on scenes that were cut and never released? well argued
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#12 |
Viggoholic
Join Date: Mar 2002
Location: Australia
Posts: 1,749
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I think this is it: most people don't mind Arwen taking Glorfindel's role. They do mind her taking away from the courage Frodo has in the books. I might say this again as well: most people don't mind Tom Bombadil being left out, and most people didn't expect a movie which followed the book scene-by-scene.
![]() Well, she is XenaArwen/XenaElf in the movies compared to in the books. In the book she makes a banner and gives Frodo her star-jewel (not Evenstar!!) In the movies she resuces Frodo after he was stabbed, nearly was given a fighting role at Helm's Deep and is involved in the ROTK as well. Anyway, does it really matter what name we give her?
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#13 | |
I am Freddie/UNDERCOVER/ Founder of The Great Continent of Entmoot
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#14 | ||
I am Freddie/UNDERCOVER/ Founder of The Great Continent of Entmoot
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#15 |
Viggoholic
Join Date: Mar 2002
Location: Australia
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I don't mind Arwen's role in the FOTR (I dislike it, however, in TTT). If she had been given a role that was close to Glorfindel's in the book, I would be very happy. But then she rides with Frodo to the Ford, says the crappy "if you want him, come and claim him", brandishes a sword; and all the while Frodo is silent (or groaning). In the book Frodo says: By Elbereth and Lúthien the Fair, you shall have neither the Ring nor me! As I've said before, why change the master's wonderful work? Frodo is strong: how else could he get the Ring to Mount Doom? In the book he survives for days after being stabbed.
Nobody's saying Arwen role has as much action as, say, Aragorn's or Legolas'. It's just her role in the movies has much more action than in the books. In the books I think she would be a strong elf, it's just that Tolkien didn't involve her in the action. Look at her ancestory: Lúthien, Beren, Tuor, Turgon, Galadriel, Fingolfin. Not too bad. ![]()
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#16 | ||
I am Freddie/UNDERCOVER/ Founder of The Great Continent of Entmoot
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#17 |
Enting
Join Date: Feb 2002
Location: New England
Posts: 59
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The sum total of Arwen's "action" in the film is riding a horse and then drawing a sword. Her intention is not to use the weapon but rather to draw the wraiths into the river. You claim definitively that she was meant to "come off" as some saturday afternoon action character. It must be interesting to be able to crawl into the directors head. If you cannot accept the daughter of Elrond granddaughter of Earendil and heir of Beren and Luthien doing these very menial and hardly extraordinary things you are beyond purist - you are a literalist. The suggestion is that anything that was not explicitly spelled out in the literature is totally out of bounds.
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#18 | |
Viggoholic
Join Date: Mar 2002
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Quote:
![]() Curufinwe: I said in my last post I thought that Arwen in the books was strong, especially given her ancestory. Compared to the books, movie-Arwen is involved in a lot of action scenes.
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#19 | |
I am Freddie/UNDERCOVER/ Founder of The Great Continent of Entmoot
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#20 | ||
I am Freddie/UNDERCOVER/ Founder of The Great Continent of Entmoot
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