Pope candidates

[Gwaimir Windgem]

While I doubt many people would be like, "Ye gods, a woman running for president. How scandalous", I do think most people be either less or more inclined to vote for a woman than for a man. Less because of a (in most cases) gut reaction against it, or more because of a desire to seem open-minded and inclusive, which I think was a lot of the impetus behind the faction that supported Arinze as the successor to the Holy Father. Don't get me wrong, he's a great man, and he would be I think the second best after Pope Benedict, but people had a tendency to play up the black factor too much.

[hectorberlioz]

Originally Posted by Gwaimir Windgem

While I doubt many people would be like, "Ye gods, a woman running for president. How scandalous", I do think most people be either less or more inclined to vote for a woman than for a man. Less because of a (in most cases) gut reaction against it, or more because of a desire to seem open-minded and inclusive, which I think was a lot of the impetus behind the faction that supported Arinze as the successor to the Holy Father. Don't get me wrong, he's a great man, and he would be I think the second best after Pope Benedict, but people had a tendency to play up the black factor too much.

Yes, and I agree about Arinze. That was a big question of my dad's, Arinze black, or Benedict long-timer? It wouldn't be a bad thing if he was the next pope...

[Gwaimir Windgem]

I've got my fingers crossed.

[hectorberlioz]

Originally Posted by Gwaimir Windgem

I've got my fingers crossed.

Really? No other candidate in your mind? ...btw, what about during the previous conclave?

[Gwaimir Windgem]

Bertgoglio or Castrillo would be good; I also like Schonborn, even if he is a heretic.

Last election, I favoured Arinze, largely because he was the one I knew the most about.

[hectorberlioz]

Originally Posted by Gwaimir Windgem

Bertgoglio or Castrillo would be good; I also like Schonborn, even if he is a heretic.

Last election, I favoured Arinze, largely because he was the one I knew the most about.

Aha...Benedict reluctee, eh? (notice, reluctee is not a real word...to my knowledge. But once again, my genius for new words...)

I knew about Arinze and Ratzinger the most...they were the names that came up the most.

[Gwaimir Windgem]

Originally Posted by Gwaimir Windgem

While I doubt many people would be like, "Ye gods, a woman running for president. How scandalous", I do think most people be either less or more inclined to vote for a woman than for a man. Less because of a (in most cases) gut reaction against it, or more because of a desire to seem open-minded and inclusive, which I think was a lot of the impetus behind the faction that supported Arinze as the successor to the Holy Father. Don't get me wrong, he's a great man, and he would be I think the second best after Pope Benedict, but people had a tendency to play up the black factor too much.

I would like to protest. I did not have the hubris to start a thread on "Pope Candidates", despite whatever slander Earniel might spread about me.

[The last sane person]

Heh, good for her!

[sisterandcousinandaunt]

Originally Posted by The last sane person

Heh, good for her!

Why, because she was rude? What's the point of that?

[The last sane person]

Yes, it's rude. Women should have their head covered and cannot wear white. Some assanine religious rule or another.

Personally I just dont give a fark, but hey some people do. Laura Bush doesn't but hey, this is the land of do whatever-the-****-you-want so it doesn't matter!

[sisterandcousinandaunt]

Originally Posted by The last sane person

Yes, it's rude. Women should have their head covered and cannot wear white. Some assanine religious rule or another.

Personally I just dont give a fark, but hey some people do. Laura Bush doesn't but hey, this is the land of do whatever-the-****-you-want so it doesn't matter!

If YOU would like to meet the Pope painted blue and call him 'Yo, Dude", more power to you.

Her official JOB, for which the citizens of this country pay all her living expenses, travel, etc., including expensive protocol experts, is to represent our country gracefully.

Looking like Britney Spears is off the list. Or the mother of the bride or whatever she was playin' at. No wonder her girls are such ... embarrassments.

[GrayMouser]

Originally Posted by sisterandcousinandaunt

If YOU would like to meet the Pope painted blue and call him 'Yo, Dude", more power to you.

Her official JOB, for which the citizens of this country pay all her living expenses, travel, etc., including expensive protocol experts, is to represent our country gracefully.

Looking like Britney Spears is off the list. Or the mother of the bride or whatever she was playin' at. No wonder her girls are such ... embarrassments.

When you're a guest, you follow the rules of your host, though I remember every right-winger in America screaming "dhimmitude!" when Nancy Pelosi wore a headscarf when meeting Muslim leaders in their own countries (somehow, they didn't notive Laura Bush and Condi Rice doing the same thing.)

When someone's a guest in your country, they follow your rules.

Given that the justification for women covering their head (according to catholicplanet.com, anyway) is

"But I want you to understand that the head of every man is Christ, the head of a woman is her husband, and the head of Christ is God. Any man who prays or prophesies with his head covered dishonors his head, but any woman who prays or prophesies with her head unveiled dishonors her head�it is the same as if her head were shaven. For if a woman will not veil herself, then she should cut off her hair; but if it is disgraceful for a woman to be shorn or shaven, let her wear a veil.
"For a man ought not to cover his head, since he is the image and glory of God; but woman is the glory of man. (For man was not made from woman, but woman from man. Neither was man created for woman, but woman for man.) That is why a woman ought to have a veil on her head, because of the angels....If any one is disposed to be contentious, we recognize no other practice, nor do the churches of God." (1 Corinthians 11:3-10,16)

So a woman should cover her head around the pope to show her submission to men.

[sisterandcousinandaunt]

Actually, it was more like to show humility to God, that one wore a head covering in church, but the problem here is not that the Bushs don't show humility, because their whole Imperial thing is all hubris, it's because it doesn't show respect.

Yes, theoretically you can serve pork at the state dinner for Ehud Olmert, and he can just eat the veggies. But it ain't polite. What would it cost her to be polite? It's not like she didn't have anything else to wear. @@

[GrayMouser]

Originally Posted by sisterandcousinandaunt

Actually, it was more like to show humility to God, that one wore a head covering in church, but the problem here is not that the Bushs don't show humility, because their whole Imperial thing is all hubris, it's because it doesn't show respect.

Yes, theoretically you can serve pork at the state dinner for Ehud Olmert, and he can just eat the veggies. But it ain't polite. What would it cost her to be polite? It's not like she didn't have anything else to wear. @@

So if a Saudi Arabian religious leader turns up she should wear a burqa?

[The last sane person]

Meh... I'm more insulted that the Catholics stole the idea of the pope wearing white and his visitors wearing dark or black from Zorastrians.

I don't personally care WHAT she does. We're a ****ing embarassment anyways.

[Gwaimir Windgem]

Originally Posted by The last sane person

Meh... I'm more insulted that the Catholics stole the idea of the pope wearing white and his visitors wearing dark or black from Zorastrians.

I don't personally care WHAT she does. We're a ****ing embarassment anyways.

Erm...no. It was started with Pope Pius V, who was a Dominican



and chose to continue wearing his habit after his election. Other popes continued to wear white, and the papal habit was simplified to the cassock and mozzetta.

I am curious: what Zoroastrian custom, exactly, were you thinking we'd hijacked?

I'm also curious, why you would be insulted by that? Customs and practices flow quite freely over ethnic and religious boundaries, and have done so throughout history. Why would a particular example be offensive?

[BeardofPants]

If you're a joe/joan bloggs, then I don't suppose it matters how you represent yerself in front of the pope. HOWEVER, if you are in a diplomatic position, then it should be readily apparent that it's good manners when entertaining your guest to undertake their customs. *shrug*

[The Gaffer]

I'm a bit confused. What did she do exactly?

Everybody here is in fits of LOL because Gordon Brown is on a state visit to the US at the same time, and nobody in the US cares because the Pope's in town.

[sisterandcousinandaunt]

Well, I knew he was here, but I figured he went to the wrong address, because I saw him meeting with Barack.

I mean, nice to be in on the ground floor, and all.

[Curubethion]

catholicplanet.com does not appear to be a reputable Catholic source. A quick glance of mine at their Eschatological section indicates that they are not in line with what I would consider to be orthodoxy. It's just a bit wacko. I didn't see the site referencing the Catechism of the Catholic Church (the best place to go to for a reference on Catholic teachings) anywhere. They just extrapolated from scriptures.

And I don't have any clue what one previous poster was talking about when they implied that some religious rule would've prohibited Mrs. Bush from wearing white, and required her to wear a veil. I'd like to see a specific reference, rather than some vague mention of hearsay. I have heard nothing of this moral commandment.