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05-10-2009, 09:11 PM | #1 |
Sapling
Join Date: May 2009
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Arwen vs Glorfindel
Okay... Arwen does not ride Asfaloth or bring Frodo to Rivendell. What the heck was up with Jackson taking out Glorfindel?
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05-11-2009, 09:02 AM | #2 |
Elf Lord
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Slicing and dicing to make the time limits, most likely. But then there's the whole enchilada about political correctness and sensibilities to the distaff side which had to be embraced allegedly, too. Mainly time constraints, like for Tom Bombadil, I think.
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05-11-2009, 10:32 AM | #3 |
Elf Lord
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It was because of the modern feminist viewpoints of the screenwriters. No other reason.
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05-11-2009, 04:02 PM | #4 |
Hero of Hyrule
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Liv Tyler didn't have enough parts.
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05-11-2009, 04:09 PM | #5 |
AngAdan
Join Date: Sep 2002
Location: Boerne, Texas
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Its the nature of the Genre, in movies you do not have as much time for character develeopment as you do in books, and you need to consolidate the number and functions of charactors.
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11-17-2009, 08:24 PM | #6 |
Sapling
Join Date: Nov 2009
Location: New Zealand, the land of the hobbits
Posts: 6
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Yes, Thats very much true. To suddenly introduce a character especially one as powerful as glorfindal and then have him not making another appearance throughout the movie it would leave people wondering what happened. It was a wise decision on the part of PJ for more efficient character progression.
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11-18-2009, 03:25 AM | #7 |
Elf Lord
Join Date: Feb 2003
Location: Ilha Formosa
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As I've said before, my reaction on first reading of Aragorn's wedding in the book was "Who the heck is she?"
Filling the character out more was necessary for the movie, and her "action figure" was a nod to our changed views on the role of women in adventures. Far worse was sticking her into the later parts, with the "What- if I get married I could have a baby?" reaction- Elrond, you should have that talk with her a long time before- and the "her fate is tied to the Ring"- huh? Though I did appreciate more respect being shown to the Sword That Was Broken- in the book it was reforged off-stage and just mentioned in passing.
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11-19-2009, 12:15 PM | #8 |
Elven Warrior
Join Date: Aug 2007
Location: Somewhere not of this world
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Oye, even in the Battle for Middle Earth games, they made Glorfindel a push-over. Even Arwen was powerless in the game compared to most characters. The movies and especially the games didn't get much right, but at least the games included Glorfindel. In the movies they made Arwen look like an Elven chick who could get *$#@ done. Then from the second movie on, she was sort of the helpless damsel in distress. The whole "her fate and the ring's are one" thing was just so out of place. Not much was explained with that. It's just "hey, Aragorn's gonna be the king, except his girlfriend is all like messed up and *$@#, how convenient, now Aragorn is pwned." I didn't even see any other Elves flinching as the ring's power grew. If anything, people would just covet the ring more as it passed closer to its master and gained more power.
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11-20-2009, 07:27 PM | #9 | |
Elven Warrior
Join Date: Sep 2008
Posts: 222
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Quote:
Also, Jackson took Haldir and expanded his role, for example. |
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05-11-2009, 05:08 PM | #10 |
Sapling
Join Date: May 2009
Location: the Akallabêth
Posts: 8
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Pretty much what everyone else has said.
Kowtowing to feminist trends, making alterations to fit time constraints, giving Liv enough screen time to placate her, etc - I believe all of that played a role in what was finally seen on film. |
04-06-2010, 11:17 PM | #11 |
Sapling
Join Date: Apr 2010
Posts: 6
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Quite simply, there aren't enough chicks in the story and the most prominent one is just another warrior. Arwen's expanded role didn't really bother me much in the films, but it's true her character is inconsistent, which is just as well, because as an actress, Liv Tyler makes a fine piece of wood.
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04-07-2010, 06:13 PM | #12 | |
Dread Mothy Lord and Halfwitted Apprentice Loremaster
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Quote:
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04-09-2010, 08:46 PM | #13 |
The Black Númenórean
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Thenwhydidiyoupostinthethread?Thenwhydidiyoupostin thethread?Thenwhydidiyoupostinthethread?
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04-28-2010, 07:56 PM | #14 |
Dread Mothy Lord and Halfwitted Apprentice Loremaster
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Because it's so much more fun to just draw attention to an existing double entendre than to take it and run too far.
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Crux fidelis, inter omnes arbor una nobilis. Nulla talem silva profert, fronde, flore, germine. Dulce lignum, dulce clavo, dulce pondus sustinens. 'With a melon?' - Eric Idle |
07-06-2010, 07:59 AM | #15 | |
Elf Lord
Join Date: Jun 2002
Location: Durham, England
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I don't understand the fuss about Arwen. There are too many cameos in LOTR to faithfully reproduce all in a film. Arwen is a useful character because she can be used to highlight the true differences between the physically similar Men and Elves, and also the difficulty her people have in finally abandoning Middle Earth. Plus her conversations with Aragorn provide insight to his heritage, backstory and reluctance to assert his claim to royalty. How quaintly charming it is that some people cry "political correctness" and "kowtowing to feminist trends" in a role that makes great play of a woman who decides she can't be fulfilled until she's dutifully married, no matter what the personal sacrifice.... A more suitable candidate for "kowtowing" would be the willful shield-maiden who insists on joining the battle and gets the line "Fool, I am no man"... and she, you will find, is in then original text.
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07-06-2010, 03:50 PM | #16 | |
Elven Warrior
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Quote:
I find nothing 'un-cinematic' about Glorfindel's approach in the book actually, and making the character Arwen (if one must that is, in theory) does not mean the same approach could not have been used. I don't find 'too many characters' (which is basically Jackson's own response here IIRC) very compelling outside of a general concern for the film as a whole, especially since Legolas could have been used here instead of Arwen, and since Jackson chose to expand Haldir's role for example, giving him something to do later in the films. Last edited by Galin : 07-06-2010 at 09:45 PM. |
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07-07-2010, 01:52 AM | #17 |
Leaf-Crowned Lord Of Elvenpath
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No, he couldn't have. He woulda gone amock on horseback and shot the nazgûl to pincushions. Wouldn't that have ruined the illusion of invulnerability (that at least I got of them at first)...
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07-08-2010, 07:06 AM | #18 | ||
Elf Lord
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Quote:
Quote:
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08-14-2010, 04:36 PM | #19 |
Elven Warrior
Join Date: Jan 2009
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I would guess that PJ did this to make the romance between Arwen and Aragorn more prominent than it is in the books. There is a common misconception that movies do not do well without a good romance.
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08-15-2010, 03:27 AM | #20 |
Elf Lord
Join Date: Feb 2003
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Storywise, it would make far less sense to send Legolas out to find Frodo and company, since he's an Elf from Mirkwood who's never been to Rivendell- he's the guy you're going to send out looking through the trackless wastes of Wilderland?
Plus you lose the "Gathering of the Free People" scen at the Council- though I suppose you could put in "an Elf from Mirkwood whom you've already met". Especially to somone who hasn't read the books, to who all these Elves look alike anyway.
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