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08-04-2010, 04:23 AM | #1 |
Hobbit
Join Date: Aug 2008
Posts: 19
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Peasant uprisings in fantasy
In a discussion with some friends we discovered that something is missing in the fantasy novels in our knowledge. As we have very little sympathy for real feudal lords it would be nice to have some knights in shining armor pierced with pitch forks. Peasant rebellions was rather common in many historical societies but I can't recall any fantasy novels that include them in the story.
I would like to know if there is any at all. I want wizards, dragons and peasants with noble blood on their hands. Can anyone help me? |
08-04-2010, 08:40 AM | #2 |
Elf Lord
Join Date: Jun 2002
Location: Durham, England
Posts: 694
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Very good question. Funny isn't it; fantasy novels are essentially based in a version of the past, yet authors seem hard-pressed to envisage internal dissent. Monarchy (which we know from history can throw up as many bloodthirsty nutters as "just and fair kings") seems to be assumed to act with the support of the population. Just and fair kings rule just and fair populations: evil emperors reflect the expansionist bloodlust of their evil populace. Rebellions are almost always against an external occupying force, not against the indigenous ruling class.
Sci fi, by comparison, finds it hard to look to a version of the future without envisaging someone rebelling against whatever system is in place. If you find a fantasy novel about peasant rebellion let me know, it would make a refreshing change! The best I can think of is a sci fi (of course) short called "Divide & Rule" by L Sprague de Camp, where a race of aliens re-introduce sword-and-armour feudalism to, well, divide and rule the world. The aristocratic classes get the benefits and so need rebelling against by the lower classes, but ultimately of course the real enemy are the aliens so it's not a true class war. Best I can come up with, though.
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08-05-2010, 12:49 AM | #3 | |
Elf Lord
Join Date: Feb 2003
Location: Ilha Formosa
Posts: 2,068
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Good point! This ties into a post I made a few days ago on the Lewis Tolkien vs Pulllman thread concerning the origins of High/Heroic Fantasy.
quoting myself Quote:
Tolkien himself said 'Touching your cap to the Squire may be damn bad for the Squire, but it's damn good for you', a totally pernicious sentiment. Science Fiction, OTOH, is basically a child of the Enlightenment- the belief in reason, equality, democracy Couple of essays by David Brin (they're from Salon, so you might have to click through an ad for the Economist) On Tolkien http://www.salon.com/entertainment/f...7/tolkien_brin Star Wars vs. Star Trek http://www.salon.com/entertainment/m...6/15/brin_main
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Glendower: I can call spirits from the vasty deep. Hotspur: Why, so can I, or so can any man; But will they come when you do call for them? "I like pigs. Dogs look up to us, cats look down on us, but pigs treat us as equals."- Winston Churchill |
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08-05-2010, 01:58 PM | #4 |
Dread Mothy Lord and Halfwitted Apprentice Loremaster
Join Date: Dec 2002
Location: Thomas Aquinas College, Santa Paula, CA
Posts: 10,820
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Dude, this guy is even less critical of the Enlightenment than Tolkien is of the Eldar.
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Crux fidelis, inter omnes arbor una nobilis. Nulla talem silva profert, fronde, flore, germine. Dulce lignum, dulce clavo, dulce pondus sustinens. 'With a melon?' - Eric Idle Last edited by Gwaimir Windgem : 08-05-2010 at 02:11 PM. |
08-06-2010, 12:20 AM | #5 |
Elf Lord
Join Date: Feb 2003
Location: Ilha Formosa
Posts: 2,068
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Well, he is making an argument...and he does give the Prof some props....
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Glendower: I can call spirits from the vasty deep. Hotspur: Why, so can I, or so can any man; But will they come when you do call for them? "I like pigs. Dogs look up to us, cats look down on us, but pigs treat us as equals."- Winston Churchill |
08-06-2010, 12:48 AM | #6 |
Elf Lord
Join Date: Feb 2003
Location: Ilha Formosa
Posts: 2,068
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As far as uprisings go, how about the Dwarfs in "The Last Battle"? They're workers, not peasants- miners, of course - but after fighting against the Calormenes they refuse to fight for the restoration of the rightful monarch and are unwilling to return to their appointed subordinate place in the hierarchy of God, King and Country (Aslan, Tirian, Narnia).
Lewis, of course, thinks this is a Bad Thing. The Dwarfs are being selfish, thinking only of themselves, unlike the King and his supporters, who are trying to restore the Good Life for everyone- that a restoration puts them back in charge in no way represents any self-interest on their part. I've gone on at great length in the Lewis thread to show this represents the traditional conservative* view of a place for everyone, and everyone in their place, as in that great old Anglican hymn "All Things Bright and Beautiful": "The rich man in his castle, the poor man at his gate [God] made them high and lowly He created their estate." In fact, I believe that not only was this Lewis's blast at the working classes seduction by the siren call of godless socialism, it was also specifically directed- dare I say an allegory?-at the Labour government elected in 1945 ( as of course was the Scouring of the Shire). *traditional feudal/landowner conservatism, not the modern Reagan/Thatcher type, which is a branch of liberalism.
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Glendower: I can call spirits from the vasty deep. Hotspur: Why, so can I, or so can any man; But will they come when you do call for them? "I like pigs. Dogs look up to us, cats look down on us, but pigs treat us as equals."- Winston Churchill Last edited by GrayMouser : 08-06-2010 at 12:50 AM. |
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