Gimli Knows Elvish?

Firekitten2006 · 02-03-2003, 06:23 PM

Just an interesting question

or at least I think so. At Helm's Deep Aragorn said "Ladders!" but in Elvish. And Gimli said "good!" Now i know in the Appendixes it said that Dwarves knew some Elvish but in the EE of FOTR he doesnt know what Haldir, Aragorn, and Legolas are saying. So what happened? Overlooked mistake by PJ? or Gimli only knew the Elvish word for ladders? lol

Evenstar1400 · 02-03-2003, 06:35 PM

v. good question. have no idea.

WallRocker · 02-03-2003, 08:10 PM

I never thought of that before(even after seeing the movie five times

) Maaybe Gimli saw the ladders, or he just happened to know that word in Elvish.

Gwaimir Windgem · 02-03-2003, 08:11 PM

Interesting, I wonder how this will be justified...

Shadowfax · 02-03-2003, 09:20 PM

Maybe he was just being super agreeable.

Firekitten2006 · 02-03-2003, 10:04 PM

but he wouldnt have known what Aragorn was saying! lol thats the whole problem...its like inconsistent, if PJ is saying that Gimli knows Elvish (or at least the word for Ladders) when in the EE he didnt know any, and got pretty pissed at Haldir, Aragorn, and Legolas for leaving him out.

Legolas_Frodo_Aragorn · 02-03-2003, 10:05 PM

wow...good point

Diamond · 02-03-2003, 11:02 PM

He most likely does not know what Aragorn is saying. But the guy is raring for a fight.

Most of the time, you can know words or phrases in a foreign language (take my Spanish class for example), but when it comes time to string them together into conversations, then it gets a little bit more difficult. For instance I can say "Hola, como estás?" and answer the question appropriately as well as other appropriate questions and answers, but if you dropped me in the middle of Mexico or Spain, I would doubtlessly be hopelessly lost.

Di

Ellison · 02-03-2003, 11:26 PM

Heh! I'm thinkin he's gotta like ladders or something?

Huan · 02-04-2003, 01:34 AM

Firekitten, that is such a good observation. I never caught that! You get caught up in it, and Gimli's growling, "Good! Bring them on!" and you just go with it. But how DID he know what Aragorn's alarm-call was? The suggestion that he saw the ladders is likely, except that as they never tire of reminding you throughout the film, Gimli is, like, really short. He couldn't see over the wall. But I suppose he saw one of the quickest-rising ladders as Aragorn was shouting the alarm. Sure, that's it.

Naugrim · 02-04-2003, 09:13 AM

I think Gimli did understand Elvish. I mean, the Dwarves of Nogrod and Belegost used Sindarin in their dealings with Doriath, and I suppose the Dwarves of Khazad-dum did the same with the Noldor of Eregion.

Gwaimir Windgem · 02-04-2003, 10:16 AM

I believe the Noldor of Eregion were long gone by now. Also, Gimli was from Erebor, not Khazad-dum, if I am correct.

Beleg Strongbow · 02-04-2003, 02:04 PM

yep.
But: Gimli, I think, did know some elvish. First of all, there are about a jillion times in the books where someone yells "Yrch!" and someone else -- often Gimli -- yells "Orcs!" after that. I think it's Tolkien's running joke.

And in the EE of FotR, Gimli insults the Elves in Elvish when they meet. Aragorn goes "That was not so courteous." Can anyone tell me what he said?

Narsil's Master · 02-04-2003, 02:13 PM

I think he was just sarcastically assessing the situation.

Gwaimir Windgem · 02-04-2003, 04:54 PM

I'm pretty sure that was actually supposed to be Khuzdul.

According to the Appendices, the word Yrch appears twice in LotR; the first time, an Elf says Yrch, and Frodo says Orcs. The second time, they can see black figures, and Legolas says Yrch, and Gimli says Orcs; but I think that was more both of them exclaiming that there were Orcs, rather than Gimli translating Legolas' exclamation.

Firekitten2006 · 02-04-2003, 05:45 PM

Well I know in the books he knew a little bit of Elvish. But just going on what is in the movies, you get the idea that he doesnt know a single word of Elvish! lol

Thank You Huan *bows* but I only saw the movie once

I realized that in the script that I found, and remembered that threw me off when I was watching the movie

Legolas_Frodo_Aragorn · 02-04-2003, 05:51 PM

defiently true about the spanish thing...

Diamond · 02-04-2003, 07:50 PM

Quote:

And in the EE of FotR, Gimli insults the Elves in Elvish when they meet. Aragorn goes "That was not so courteous." Can anyone tell me what he said?

Here it says it is supposed to be Khuzdul, and apparently someone says it means "plague upon your necks", which works for me.

Di

Legolas_Frodo_Aragorn · 02-04-2003, 08:35 PM

wait....when in the movie?????

Gwaimir Windgem · 02-04-2003, 09:11 PM

Khuzdul is an extremely limited language; they probably just said that because Gimli said, "A plague on the stiff necks of Elves!" in the book.

02-03-2003, 06:23 PM	#1
Firekitten2006 Elven Warrior Join Date: Oct 2002 Location: the US of A! But I wish i was in austraila, never been, just think it would be a fun place to live :) Posts: 372	Gimli Knows Elvish? Just an interesting question or at least I think so. At Helm's Deep Aragorn said "Ladders!" but in Elvish. And Gimli said "good!" Now i know in the Appendixes it said that Dwarves knew some Elvish but in the EE of FOTR he doesnt know what Haldir, Aragorn, and Legolas are saying. So what happened? Overlooked mistake by PJ? or Gimli only knew the Elvish word for ladders? lol __________________ I'm Baaaack!!

02-03-2003, 06:35 PM	#2
Evenstar1400 Elven Warrior Join Date: Jan 2003 Location: In the inner depths of my lair. Posts: 421	v. good question. have no idea. __________________ Treebeard: Hmm, you look like hobbits, smell like hobbits, feel like hobbits and sound like hobbits. You must be orcs!

02-03-2003, 08:10 PM	#3
WallRocker Elven Warrior Join Date: Nov 2002 Location: At the computer... Posts: 376	I never thought of that before(even after seeing the movie five times ) Maaybe Gimli saw the ladders, or he just happened to know that word in Elvish. __________________ Do one thing every day that scares you ~Anonymous~ <>< <>< <>< <>< <>< <>< <>< <><<>< <>< <>< <>< I pledge allegiance to the flag of the United States of America And to the Republic for which it stands One nation UNDER GOD with liberty and justice for all

02-03-2003, 08:11 PM	#4
Gwaimir Windgem Dread Mothy Lord and Halfwitted Apprentice Loremaster Join Date: Dec 2002 Location: Thomas Aquinas College, Santa Paula, CA Posts: 10,820	Interesting, I wonder how this will be justified... __________________ Crux fidelis, inter omnes arbor una nobilis. Nulla talem silva profert, fronde, flore, germine. Dulce lignum, dulce clavo, dulce pondus sustinens. 'With a melon?' - Eric Idle

02-03-2003, 09:20 PM	#5
Shadowfax The Fleet-Footed Join Date: Mar 2002 Location: British Columbia Posts: 913	Maybe he was just being super agreeable. __________________ Jesus saved me "To remain ignorant of things that happened before you were born is to remain a child" (Cicero, 106-43 B.C.) "Art is a lie which makes us realize the truth" (Picasso)

02-03-2003, 10:04 PM	#6
Firekitten2006 Elven Warrior Join Date: Oct 2002 Location: the US of A! But I wish i was in austraila, never been, just think it would be a fun place to live :) Posts: 372	but he wouldnt have known what Aragorn was saying! lol thats the whole problem...its like inconsistent, if PJ is saying that Gimli knows Elvish (or at least the word for Ladders) when in the EE he didnt know any, and got pretty pissed at Haldir, Aragorn, and Legolas for leaving him out. __________________ I'm Baaaack!!

02-03-2003, 10:05 PM	#7
Legolas_Frodo_Aragorn The Elven Queen Of All Pyros Join Date: Jan 2003 Location: Im like a little bug stuck in the lamp...never going anywhere Posts: 795	wow...good point __________________ Would you judge my future based on what i did in the past? Procrastinators Unite!!!.....tomorrrow.... Kids in backseats cause accidents...accidents in backseats cause kids As long as there are tests..there will be prayers in school

02-03-2003, 11:02 PM	#8
Diamond Hobbit Join Date: Feb 2003 Location: Minas Tirith Posts: 45	He most likely does not know what Aragorn is saying. But the guy is raring for a fight. Most of the time, you can know words or phrases in a foreign language (take my Spanish class for example), but when it comes time to string them together into conversations, then it gets a little bit more difficult. For instance I can say "Hola, como estás?" and answer the question appropriately as well as other appropriate questions and answers, but if you dropped me in the middle of Mexico or Spain, I would doubtlessly be hopelessly lost. Di __________________ I see in your eyes the fear that would take the heart of me... There will be a day when the strength of men fails, but it is not this day!" "He was twitching!" "He was twitching because he has my axe embedded in his nervous system!" Last edited by Diamond : 02-03-2003 at 11:13 PM.

02-04-2003, 01:34 AM	#10
Huan Elven Warrior Join Date: Jan 2003 Location: Oxford, MS Posts: 274	Firekitten, that is such a good observation. I never caught that! You get caught up in it, and Gimli's growling, "Good! Bring them on!" and you just go with it. But how DID he know what Aragorn's alarm-call was? The suggestion that he saw the ladders is likely, except that as they never tire of reminding you throughout the film, Gimli is, like, really short. He couldn't see over the wall. But I suppose he saw one of the quickest-rising ladders as Aragorn was shouting the alarm. Sure, that's it.

02-04-2003, 09:13 AM	#11
Naugrim Hobbit Join Date: Jan 2002 Location: Philippines Posts: 15	I think Gimli did understand Elvish. I mean, the Dwarves of Nogrod and Belegost used Sindarin in their dealings with Doriath, and I suppose the Dwarves of Khazad-dum did the same with the Noldor of Eregion.

02-04-2003, 10:16 AM	#12
Gwaimir Windgem Dread Mothy Lord and Halfwitted Apprentice Loremaster Join Date: Dec 2002 Location: Thomas Aquinas College, Santa Paula, CA Posts: 10,820	I believe the Noldor of Eregion were long gone by now. Also, Gimli was from Erebor, not Khazad-dum, if I am correct. __________________ Crux fidelis, inter omnes arbor una nobilis. Nulla talem silva profert, fronde, flore, germine. Dulce lignum, dulce clavo, dulce pondus sustinens. 'With a melon?' - Eric Idle

02-04-2003, 02:04 PM	#13
Beleg Strongbow Truest of Friends Join Date: Apr 2002 Location: Pennsylvania, but I have a vacation home in the Westfarthing. Posts: 520	yep. But: Gimli, I think, did know some elvish. First of all, there are about a jillion times in the books where someone yells "Yrch!" and someone else -- often Gimli -- yells "Orcs!" after that. I think it's Tolkien's running joke. And in the EE of FotR, Gimli insults the Elves in Elvish when they meet. Aragorn goes "That was not so courteous." Can anyone tell me what he said? __________________ "...Beleg Strongbow, truest of friends, greatest in skill of all that harboured in the woods of Beleriand in the Elder Days..." Aure Entuleva! John Kerry for President!

02-04-2003, 02:13 PM	#14
Narsil's Master Elven Warrior Join Date: Feb 2003 Location: Indian,USA Posts: 109	I think he was just sarcastically assessing the situation. __________________ naur an edraith amen, naur dan i ngaurhoth! well your on fire now. go team fencing!!!! fingolfin rox elven sox

02-04-2003, 04:54 PM	#15
Gwaimir Windgem Dread Mothy Lord and Halfwitted Apprentice Loremaster Join Date: Dec 2002 Location: Thomas Aquinas College, Santa Paula, CA Posts: 10,820	I'm pretty sure that was actually supposed to be Khuzdul. According to the Appendices, the word Yrch appears twice in LotR; the first time, an Elf says Yrch, and Frodo says Orcs. The second time, they can see black figures, and Legolas says Yrch, and Gimli says Orcs; but I think that was more both of them exclaiming that there were Orcs, rather than Gimli translating Legolas' exclamation. __________________ Crux fidelis, inter omnes arbor una nobilis. Nulla talem silva profert, fronde, flore, germine. Dulce lignum, dulce clavo, dulce pondus sustinens. 'With a melon?' - Eric Idle

02-04-2003, 05:45 PM	#16
Firekitten2006 Elven Warrior Join Date: Oct 2002 Location: the US of A! But I wish i was in austraila, never been, just think it would be a fun place to live :) Posts: 372	Well I know in the books he knew a little bit of Elvish. But just going on what is in the movies, you get the idea that he doesnt know a single word of Elvish! lol Thank You Huan bows but I only saw the movie once I realized that in the script that I found, and remembered that threw me off when I was watching the movie __________________ I'm Baaaack!!

02-04-2003, 05:51 PM	#17
Legolas_Frodo_Aragorn The Elven Queen Of All Pyros Join Date: Jan 2003 Location: Im like a little bug stuck in the lamp...never going anywhere Posts: 795	defiently true about the spanish thing... __________________ Would you judge my future based on what i did in the past? Procrastinators Unite!!!.....tomorrrow.... Kids in backseats cause accidents...accidents in backseats cause kids As long as there are tests..there will be prayers in school

02-04-2003, 08:35 PM	#19
Legolas_Frodo_Aragorn The Elven Queen Of All Pyros Join Date: Jan 2003 Location: Im like a little bug stuck in the lamp...never going anywhere Posts: 795	wait....when in the movie????? __________________ Would you judge my future based on what i did in the past? Procrastinators Unite!!!.....tomorrrow.... Kids in backseats cause accidents...accidents in backseats cause kids As long as there are tests..there will be prayers in school

02-04-2003, 09:11 PM	#20
Gwaimir Windgem Dread Mothy Lord and Halfwitted Apprentice Loremaster Join Date: Dec 2002 Location: Thomas Aquinas College, Santa Paula, CA Posts: 10,820	Khuzdul is an extremely limited language; they probably just said that because Gimli said, "A plague on the stiff necks of Elves!" in the book. __________________ Crux fidelis, inter omnes arbor una nobilis. Nulla talem silva profert, fronde, flore, germine. Dulce lignum, dulce clavo, dulce pondus sustinens. 'With a melon?' - Eric Idle

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