The Hunt for the Ring

[Gordis]

Here is the thread to discuss the "Hunt for the Ring" as described in the texts published in Unfinished Tales (UT) and Hammond and Scull's Reader's Companion (RC).

I propose to concentrate on the second part of the Hunt, starting with the moment when the Ringwraiths broke the guard of Rangers at Sarn Ford and entered the Shire and ending with the debacle at the ford of Bruinen (September 22-October 20, 3018). We can also discuss the earlier events if we feel like it.

Here we can discuss the timing of various events, whether the nazgul showed competence or ineptitude and what mistakes they have made and why.

I have prepared a few maps with the movements of the Black Riders. but first of all I will post the time-schemes I have prepared and explain how I made them.

As you all may have noticed, Tolkien schemes depicting the movement of the Black Riders published in RC lack an important element: letters (A-I) denoting individual Riders had been edited out. (That's why there are lots of square brackets in the text). Why it was done I cannot say, and I think it was an extremely BAD idea - a wealth of information had been lost.

I have managed to re-introduce the letters in the RC text - at least most of them. For this I used two earlier time-schemes (these two with letters for the individual riders, both published in HOME 7: one on p.13, another on page 71). I have compared them with the account in the "Hunt for the Ring" RC and found that the first one (p.13) agrees with RC well, while the other one on p. 71 contradicts it. The reason for it is that the scheme published on p.71 (HOME7) reflects a different subplot, later abandoned: the Riders DE (Khamul and his companion) capture Hamilcar Bolger at Crickhollow on September 26 and carry him to the captain at Andrath. As the attack on Crckhollow in this version happens three days before it happens in LOTR, the same two nazgul DE are later sent to Bree, thus according to this version Khamul is in charge of the attacks both at Crickhollow and in Bree. Of course in the final version such thing is impossible: Khamul is a worthy nazgul, but even he cannot be in two places at once.

As for the time-sheme found in HOME 7, p.13, it differs little from the account in RC, only the latter is more complete. I quote this time-scheme in full:

From "Gandalf's Delay" in Home 7 "The treason of Isengard", p.13

Scheme D also provides an account of the movements of the individual Riders, who are identified by the letters A to I. It was D who came to Hobbiton on 23 September, the night on which Frodo left, and it was D and E who trailed the hobbits in the Shire, while G H I were on the East Road and F was to the southward. On the 25th, the day that Frodo reached Crickhollow, DEGHI assembled at the Brandywine Bridge; G waited there while H and I passed through Bree on Monday the 26th. On the
27th D and E 'got into Buckland and looked for Baggins'; on the 28th they 'located' him and went to get the help of G. On the night of the 29th DEG crossed the River by the Ferry; and on the same night H and I returned and attacked The Prancing Pony. Pursued by Gandalf from Crickhollow DEG fled to the King. ABCDEFG 'rode East after Gandalf and the supposed Baggins' on 1 October; F and G were sent direct to Weathertop, and the other five, together with H and I, rode through Bree at night, throwing down the gates, and from the inn (where Gandalf was) the noise of their passage was heard like a wind. F and G reached Weathertop on the 2nd; Gandalf was pursued North from Weathertop by C D E, while A B F G H I patrolled the East Road.

Using this scheme, I have reinserted the letters denoting individual riders (A-I) into the RC text, with a bit of uncertainty only in 2-3 cases.

Difficulties I have encountered:
1. F in the HOME account appears to be part of Khamul's group of six. His position is described as "to the southward". Later he sort of disappears from screen and reappears already at Andrath. In the RC account, Khamul's group counts five nazgul (including Khamul himself), while F seems to be a member of the WK's group of four (ABCF) guarding the borders of the Shire and Bree-Land. I have voluntarily left F to guard Sarn Ford, as this position seems the only one to agree with both accounts.

2.Another ambiguity arises when out of the group of FGHI I have to choose one to guard Weathertop.

the four Black Riders who were sent ahead assemble near Weathertop. [One] remains [while three] go on eastwards on or near Road - RC p 167

I have chosen again the same "problematic" F , just to make the layout of the table easier. Maybe Tolkien intended G or H to stay, who knows. As the result of my choice, F later falls into the group following Gandalf, while GHI remain on the main road.

3.And finally, at the very last stages of the hunt, five nazgul were on the Great road. They were divided into 2 groups, WK with one other nazgul and Khamul with two others. But which one of GHI was chosen to travel with the Captain is impossible to tell.


Dramatis personae: The Witch King (A) and eight nazgul, often divided into four pairs: BC, DE, FG, HI. Note it was also the way they had crossed Enedwaith and Minhiriath:

Now [the WK] divided his company into four pairs, and they rode separately, but he himself went ahead with the swiftest pair. Thus they passed west out of Rohan, and explored the desolation of Enedwaith, and came at last to Tharbad. Thence they rode through Minhiriath -UT

A is the Witch-King, Black Captain. Directed the operation from Andrath, visited the Barrows, then rode to Weathertop, fought with Gandalf, attacked Frodo, then patrolled the road to the Ford.

BC are two nazgul, who remain with the Captain at Andrath to guard the Breeland from the south and from the East. From Weathertop were sent to follow Gandalf north-east. Prepared the ambush at the Ford. BC always stick together. Likely they are the strongest of the Eight.

D is Khamul, the Shadow of the East, Lieutenant of Dol Guldur and Second to the chief. "He was the most ready of all the Nazgûl after the Black Captain himself, to perceive the presence of the Ring, but also the one whose power was most confused and diminished by daylight.-UT" Directed the search of the Shire, the attack on Crickhollow, on Oct. 3-6 guarded Weathertop with the Witch-King, later guarded the Bridge of Mitheithel.

E is Khamul's companion and messenger from Dol Guldur. At the beginning of the Hunt he was never far from Khamul (leading the blind man around in day-time, most likely). Later became separated from Khamul and was in the group that followed Gandalf.

F - This one had to ride a lot: twice made a round-trip to Weathertop. He is the third nazgul in Bree, who was sent to the WK with the news, but got waylaid by the Dunedain. Uncharacteristically, F was separated from his pair G from the start and also by the end. F often operated alone.

G - Was separated from F and added to DE, guarded the horses and the Bridge over Baranduin, then was riding with HI, also traveled a lot.

HI - inseparable pair, the two nazgul in Bree. Also had to ride a lot.

HERE ARE MY TIME-SCHEMES

Time scheme page 1
Time-scheme page 2

HERE ARE MY MAPS

1.Shire_Sept 22-26
2.Bree_Sept 26-29
3.Bree-Weathertop_Sept 30-Oct 3
4.Weahertop_Oct 3-6

Please have a look, so we can start the discussion.

[Alcuin]

I propose we henceforth refer to the hapless H and I as “Frick and Frack”.

-|-

This is very thorough. It will take a while to go through all of it.

(As we work through the exercise, it is worth considering which of the Nazgûl might be the other two Númenóreans. B and C are obvious choices, because the Witch-king seems to keep them with him, and because in making a list, Tolkien might start by listing the three fallen Númenóreans first; after all, Khamûl is surely D, “the vanguard Rider” who reached Bag End, and he is the “second to the Chief” (Glossary, UT). Khamûl should naturally have been designated B unless there were some other compelling reason to list him fourth (D). F and G might also good choices, because they each appear to work well independently.)

[Gordis]

Originally Posted by Alcuin

This is very thorough. It will take a while to go through all of it.

I propose to go through it together, slowly, stage by stage, day by day, pinpointing uncertainties and mistakes and assessing nazgul performance.

The first question would be to assess the Captain's order to divide into 2 main groups: ABCF and DEGHI.

I think it became necessary because too many rangers (5-10?) have escaped the slaughter of Sarn Ford and were likely to bring help. Maybe some Elves were also spotted. Thus it became necessary for the strongest nazgul to remain on the eastern and southern borders of the Shire and Breeland. Though: why did they expect aid coming from South and South-east along the Greenway and not from the North or East along the Great Road?

Originally Posted by Alcuin

I propose we henceforth refer to the hapless H and I as “Frick and Frack”.

We might, but note BC are even more "Frick and Frack-ish than HI. BC never separated, while H and I took different roads in the Shire.

Originally Posted by Alcuin

(As we work through the exercise, it is worth considering which of the Nazgûl might be the other two Númenóreans. B and C are obvious choices, because the Witch-king seems to keep them with him, and because in making a list, Tolkien might start by listing the three fallen Númenóreans first; after all, Khamûl is surely D, “the vanguard Rider” who reached Bag End, and he is the “second to the Chief” (Glossary, UT). Khamûl should naturally have been designated B unless there were some other compelling reason to list him fourth (D). F and G might also good choices, because they each appear to work well independently.)

It is not exactly true that the WK always kept BC with him: after 3.10, B and C (together with F and E) were sent to follow Gandalf, and likely B was in command of the group. I guess B may well be "Gothmog, the lieutenant of Morgul" who took the command at the Pelennor after WK's death.
Anyway, I believe B and C were the strongest combat fighters of the Eight. Does it mean they were Numenoreans? It seems likely: a Numenorean was necessarily taller and stronger physically than say an Easterliing, it goes with the race. And physical strength meant a lot in Middle-Age fights with huge swords, maces etc. On the other hand an Easterling or a Southron may have been better trained (though in 4 thousand years they all likely became quite well trained).

Also the endurance to daylight may have been a factor in choosing BC. They had to guard the Greenway day and night, even in the Captain's absence.

The choice of F to operate alone and guard Sarn Ford may also be due to his daylight resistance. He was not very strong overall, as we know this guy was later waylaid by the Dunedain at night (Sept. 29-30). But maybe by day he was stronger than say, Khamul. Note that IF both B and C were Numenoreans, F couldn't have been another one: there were but three in all, including A.

E, by the way, though weaker than Khamûl (D), was surely not so blind by daylight. He clearly led his patron D through the Central Shire to Hobbiton during daytime of Sept. 23. See here the route of DE from the South to Hobbiton.

Can we suppose that Khamûl's buddy E was also an Easterling and they called to each other in some long-forgotten Eastern tongue? Maybe G was assigned to their group because he was the third Easterling?

And in general, is it reasonable to suppose there were 3 Numenoreans, 3 Easterlings and 3 Southrons? I have met this theory several times on different forums.

Or maybe there were 3 Numenoreans, 2 Easterlings, 2 Southrons and 2 Northmen akin to the ancestors of the Rohirrim? I think the latter would be closer to the mark: in mid Second Age the ancestors of the Rohirrim had to be there somewhere in Rhovanion or to the North-East of it, well within Sauron's sphere of interest. They were tall and strong people, racially close to the House of Hador. This theory would make the division in pairs according to the race quite easy:
BC Numenoreans
DE Easterlings of mongoloid (?) (Edit: not at all sure here) races
FG and HI Northmen and Southrons

Interesting to note that the Gaffer had great pains to understand Khamul's Westron ("he spoke funny"), while according to the drafts, the nazgul in Bree were not easy to understand either: maybe they were Southrons?

Here comes my other far-fetched speculation : Edanic nazgul (ABC + the Northmen: FG) were more resistant to daylight than the Southrons HI and Easterlings DE.

Thoughts?

[Alcuin]

The Gaffer might have had trouble understanding Denethor and his archaic way of speaking Westron: like an extremely rural, half-deaf outback American or Australian farmer trying to discern what the Marquess of Milford Haven was asking him. Worse, the Nazgûl are so old, it’s not the current Marquess, who speaks modern English, but more like a contemporary of Chaucer. (Look at the deliberately archaic – and insulting – way that the Witch-king addresses Éowyn using the familiar thee/thou/thy) And worst of all, Westron wasn’t Khamûl’s native tongue, as you have noted.

Originally Posted by Gordis

This ... would make the division in pairs ... quite easy:
BC Numenoreans
DE Easterlings...
FG and HI Northmen and Southrons

...Edanic nazgul (ABC + the Northmen: FG) were more resistant to daylight than the Southrons HI and Easterlings DE.

Sounds reasonable.

-|-

(Added later)

Originally Posted by Gordis

The speed of the nazgul horses was discussed here (see post 7), in one of my first threads on Entmoot.Nazgul horses
The great ride of Gandalf from Edoras to Sarn Ford was described in detail on p. 252 RC. Seems the nazgul horses were only a tad slower than Shadowfax.

Fonstad says Gandalf with Pippin rode Shadowfax 120 miles/day to Mins Tirith from Dol Baran, and the Rohirrim rode about 80 miles a day. My straight-line measure is about 60 miles/day for the Rohirrim and 75 miles/day for Shadowfax. Grumph!

Originally Posted by Gordis

But, as far as I understand, Chris Tolkien seemingly was wrong as to the version his father had chosen as final. There was another version described only in RC p. 241-3. In this one the nazgul visited Saruman very early, "towards early? June", even before Gandalf was captured.

Anyway, I propose to leave the beginning of the Hunt for another thread. There is a lot to discuss about the period Sept 22-Oct 20 as it is.

Very well.

[Gordis]

So, let us take the first day, September 23. In early hours the five riders DEGHI invaded the Shire and rode through it during the day.

[One G] keeps to the east, passing northwards towards the Marish and Bridge. [One H] takes road leading northwest to Michel Delving, and [another I] goes with him, but there ?fares on and traverses the North Farthing. [Khamûl and his companion DE] go through the central Shire, until they reach the East Road, probably near the Three-Farthing Stone. - RC p. 97

I would say that although the maps taken from the Isengarder clearly pointed to Hobbiton as the prime target:

The Witch-king also obtained much information, including some about the only name that interested him: Baggins. It was for this reason that Hobbiton was singled out as one of the points for immediate visit and enquiry.-UT

, still much of the Shire territory had been covered.
See the map here - the riders are moving up north from Sarn Ford in three main directions: through western Shire (HI), central Shire (DE) and eastern Shire (G).

G rides through Marish directly to the Bridge of Stonebows, the principal exit from the Shire, and stays there to guard it.
Maybe G missed the existence of the Ferry, maybe he noted it while he passed by - anyway it was a serious mistake not to guard it as well. Maybe it was due to the fact that G was alone, so even if he saw the ferry, he still had to move on and guard the bridge as he was told?

By nightfall on the 23 G must have reached the bridge, H and I arrived to Michel Delving on the Great road and D (Khamul) and E came to Three-Farthing Stone. At nightfall the nazgul pairs separated, no doubt feeling surer of themselves in the dark.

I made his round-trip through the North Farthing (must have taken him all night) and H made his way eastwards along the Great road.

E keeps an eye on the East Road and Stock Road, lurking probably between the two, just south of Whitfurrows. [Khamûl D] just misses Frodo, and misled by the Gaffers [sic] starts out east again.

Khamul was alone when he visited Hobbiton. Why didn't he take his companion with him and had a good look at Bag End? After all Hobbiton was the main target, where Baggins was reportedly living: why only one nazgul there?

[jammi567]

One thing that I don't get about the Nazgul movements is why I made that massive round trip all on his own? If they had the maps, then they had to have known that there was no chance that Baggins would be up there. Unless it was a conginsency thing, just in case Baggins had changed location since Gollum had last encountered him.

As to your question, maybe it was because they realized that if they travelled in pairs or more, then they would have made themselves practically unapprachable by any sane person, even when they are fully covered up. I don't have the book on me at the moment, but I'm sure it mentioned something like that in Unfinished Tales.

[Coffeehouse]

Originally Posted by Gordis

Please have a look, so we can start the discussion.

Excellent. I'll read it all when I get the time, which probably won't be before the weekend due to the ridiculous amount of studying I have on my hands

This will be fun

[Alcuin]

I have problem right away, not with the timeline you’ve laid out, Gordis, but with dates and timelines in the published texts.

“Tale of Years” says Gandalf escaped Sept 18 SR 1418. The Black Riders cross the Fords of Isen the same day. Unfinished Tales “Hunt for the Ring” (p 339 in my Houghton Mifflin hardback) says the Nazgûl reached Isengard two days later, Sept 20, and spoke to Saruman without profit. Sept 20 is also the day Gandalf meets Théoden and starts looking for Shadowfax. Sept 21, According to Unfinished Tales “Hunt for the Ring”, the Nazgûl capture Wormtongue in the evening and learn where the Shire is (p 340). Then “Tale of Years” says the Nazgûl chase off the Rangers at Sarn Ford on the evening of September 22.

Let’s say they caught Wormtongue on the main road at the Dol Baran near the North-South Road (the south end of the Greenway, near where Aragorn met his Rangers of the North and the sons of Elrond), and that they know exactly where they’re going and exactly how to get there. It’s 250–275 miles to Tharbad, which is a dangerous crossing (Boromir lost his horse there), and another 150–160 miles to Sarn Ford. (Those are straight lines.) At 40 miles per day for a mounted rider – and I’m no horseman, but I think that’s a very respectable pace for both the horse and the rider – that should be 10 days of travel.

Now, there is an alternate version (p 346) that has the Nazgûl arriving at Isengard just before Gandalf escapes. That would still be September 18, and we still need 9 Nazgûl at Sarn Ford a mere four days later. CJRT notes in Unfinished Tales “Hunt for the Ring”, footnote 17 that from “The Tale of Years”, this version of the story seems to be one his father adopted . Even so, the Nazgûl must still move more than 100 miles a day, making an extremely dangerous crossing of the Greyflood three-fifths of the way, which would be before noon (or midnight, if there were travelling at night) of the third day.

Again, this isn’t part of the timeline Gordis has laid out. But this is a problem in the texts as they stand, unless there is something somewhere else that I’ve missed, or I’ve completely misread the material (which would not be unprecedented).

[Gordis]

Originally Posted by Alcuin

I have problem right away, not with the timeline you’ve laid out, Gordis, but with dates and timelines in the published texts.

“Tale of Years” says Gandalf escaped Sept 18 SR 1418. The Black Riders cross the Fords of Isen the same day. Unfinished Tales “Hunt for the Ring” (p 339 in my Houghton Mifflin hardback) says the Nazgûl reached Isengard two days later, Sept 20, and spoke to Saruman without profit. Sept 20 is also the day Gandalf meets Théoden and starts looking for Shadowfax. Sept 21, According to Unfinished Tales “Hunt for the Ring”, the Nazgûl capture Wormtongue in the evening and learn where the Shire is (p 340). Then “Tale of Years” says the Nazgûl chase off the Rangers at Sarn Ford on the evening of September 22.

Let’s say they caught Wormtongue on the main road at the Dol Baran near the North-South Road (the south end of the Greenway, near where Aragorn met his Rangers of the North and the sons of Elrond), and that they know exactly where they’re going and exactly how to get there. It’s 250–275 miles to Tharbad, which is a dangerous crossing (Boromir lost his horse there), and another 150–160 miles to Sarn Ford. (Those are straight lines.) At 40 miles per day for a mounted rider – and I’m no horseman, but I think that’s a very respectable pace for both the horse and the rider – that should be 10 days of travel.

Now, there is an alternate version (p 346) that has the Nazgûl arriving at Isengard just before Gandalf escapes. That would still be September 18, and we still need 9 Nazgûl at Sarn Ford a mere four days later. CJRT notes in Unfinished Tales “Hunt for the Ring”, footnote 17 that from “The Tale of Years”, this version of the story seems to be one his father adopted . Even so, the Nazgûl must still move more than 100 miles a day, making an extremely dangerous crossing of the Greyflood three-fifths of the way, which would be before noon (or midnight, if there were travelling at night) of the third day.

Again, this isn’t part of the timeline Gordis has laid out. But this is a problem in the texts as they stand, unless there is something somewhere else that I’ve missed, or I’ve completely misread the material (which would not be unprecedented).

The speed of the nazgul horses was discussed here (see post 7), in one of my first threads on Entmoot.Nazgul horses
The great ride of Gandalf from Edoras to Sarn Ford was described in detail on p. 252 RC. Seems the nazgul horses were only a tad slower than Shadowfax.

But, as far as I understand, Chris Tolkien seemingly was wrong as to the version his father had chosen as final. There was another version described only in RC p. 241-3. In this one the nazgul visited Saruman very early, "towards early? June", even before Gandalf was captured.

Anyway, I propose to leave the beginning of the Hunt for another thread. There is a lot to discuss about the period Sept 22-Oct 20 as it is.

[Gordis]

Heh
But I don't have an F-buddy!

[Alcuin]

Ok, ladies, let’s behave: there are youngsters present.

No, I’m not a Harry Potter fan. I have no idea who Fred + George are, but if you like the names, I’m delighted.

I don’t know who Bill and Charles are, either. Bill and Charles: how about Buck and Chuck?

“Homer” came from “Homer Simpson” because I’d referred to H & I as “Frick and Frack” and facetiously accused them of incompetence. Homer Simpson’s wife is Marge, but “Marge” begins with the wrong letter, so I settled for “Ida”. Homer and Idaho? (as in, “I – D’oh!”) After all, if Indiana Jones can hunt for ancient treasures for the US government, surely “Idaho Smith” can hunt for the Ring for Sauron, right?

I am neutral on this as long as the monikers are short and easy to remember. In the meantime, I am arranging notes on this end.

[Gordis]

Oh, call them whatever you like, as long as the first letter matches.

But I would love people (if anyone is interested in it) try to answer my questions regarding the Crickhollow episode:

Now questions.
1. Why didn't Khamul and E attack immediately on the night of Sept.28? Did they need an additional nazgul so badly? Or did they need horses to escape immediately after an attack on the house?
2. Why couldn't E and G and the 3 horses force their way through the Gate of Buckland on their way to Khamul? Was secrecy really that important to justify all this trouble with the ferry?
3. Why in Middle-Earth did they wait all night long by the door of an empty house?