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10-25-2008, 06:52 AM | #1 | ||
I'm Eru, and lord of Arda.
Join Date: May 2006
Location: southampton, hampshire
Posts: 2,609
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How fast was the fastest horse in the East (and the West)?
I really, really don't want to do this kind of thing, because I do want to do this kind of thing by myself. However, seeing as it involves maths, I have no choice. The following quote is from the opening post on another forum (link underneth), debating how fast Shadowfax truely was:
Quote:
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10-25-2008, 11:02 AM | #2 | |
Lady of the Ulairi
Join Date: Mar 2005
Location: Minas Morgul
Posts: 2,783
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I think the part about the great ride of Gandalf from Edoras to Hobbitton published in the Reader's Companion p. 251-252 should be taken into consaideration
Quote:
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10-25-2008, 11:27 AM | #3 |
Elf Lord
Join Date: Nov 2002
Location: charlotte, n.c.
Posts: 1,081
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Fortunately he was fast enough.
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10-25-2008, 11:44 AM | #4 |
I'm Eru, and lord of Arda.
Join Date: May 2006
Location: southampton, hampshire
Posts: 2,609
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So, really, we still haven't got any idea of how fast Shadowfx could go, as that was just Gandalf making him have unecessary rests.
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10-26-2008, 09:50 AM | #5 |
Lady of the Ulairi
Join Date: Mar 2005
Location: Minas Morgul
Posts: 2,783
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10-26-2008, 12:18 AM | #6 |
Elven Warrior
Join Date: Dec 2004
Posts: 455
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Here is an example of real life equine long-distance running average speed. This horse won with a speed of 17 km/hour which is approx. = 10 mph.
http://www.iht.com/articles/2000/08/28/horse.2.t_0.php In Shadowfax's case, he wasn't running on Churchill Downs, he was running cross-country through mixed terrain and certainly not at all, in Middle Earth in those days, as the crow flies. I think he did admirably.
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Don't curse the darkness - light a candle. Last edited by Jon S. : 10-26-2008 at 12:19 AM. |
12-28-2008, 01:01 PM | #7 |
Sapling
Join Date: Aug 2008
Location: England
Posts: 11
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well it seems gandalf's 'gale' was rather slow, but i suppose that he also had to ride up hills through wooded areas and other rivers. Although on the maps of middle earth it looks like a smoth trip from edoras to hobbiton the map does not show every river and valley.
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01-02-2016, 04:12 AM | #8 | ||
Salt Miner
Join Date: Jun 2005
Location: gone to Far Harad
Posts: 987
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I’d like to resurrect this thread so that I can refer to it later. (Yeah, I know: ulterior motives.)
Endurance horse racing is a modern sport from the 1950s. There is an organization that referees and oversees these activities in the United States, the American Endurance Ride Conference. However, I found the website of The Old Dominion Endurance Rides most helpful for information. One-day endurance rides typically cover 75 or 100 mile (121 or 161 km) courses. The longer course (100 miles) takes approximately 14–15 hours. A typical horse moving over long distance will move at medium trot, 6–8 mph (10–13 km/hr). Reading through the literature, however, it is clear that, unless a horse has been trained, its speed will be about 6 mph. Gordis quotes Tolkien’s notes in Reader's Companion on Shadowfax’s movements. Tolkien kindly gives us the number he uses for Shadowfax: 10 mph (16 km/hr). That is 5/3 the normal speed of a horse. (Thank you, Gordis. You made this much easier!) Gandalf took three days to go from Edoras to Minas Tirith on Shadowfax with Pippin. Théoden took 5 days for the same journey, albeit with a considerable, slower detour through Drúadan Forest. That’s the same ratio, 5:3. Aragorn pushed the Dúnedain horses harder on the road to Pelargir, riding them about 7 mph for about 10 hours/day for 4 days. Tolkien describes them reaching Erech “stumbling with weariness”. Don’t be deceived by these “low” numbers. We live in age of machines that move faster than we do, sometimes so fast we can’t keep up and are at peril of our lives. (AI weaponry is a terrible thing, and it’s coming sooner than you think.) The story is told that some well-educated folk thought there was a risk to passengers riding trains at 20 mph a couple of hundred years ago: that was as far as you could expect to move in a day. There’s another thing to consider, too: people actually have more endurance than most animals. We don’t run fast, but we can run a long time (when trained and in condition): there’s a marathon race every year in Wales between humans and horses: they shortened it for the horses. In the 1970s, a Soviet survey team discovered a family of Old Believers living in remote Siberia. The son was in his early 20s: he hunted (quite successfully) by chasing down deer. Moving 60 miles an hour in an automobile and flying across the Atlantic in 5 hours are things that have only emerged in last 80 years, in just one lifetime. Tolkien was very much aware of how far and how fast horses could move. He grew up as an earlier age was coming to an end; and he studied professionally histories and tales of how people moved in older days. In preparing this post, I discovered a thread in which one person posted, Quote:
Shadowfax was moving 60% faster than other horses, running 5 miles for every 3 miles they could run. ─╫─ Quote:
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10-28-2016, 01:26 PM | #9 |
High King at Annuminas Administrator
Join Date: Oct 2003
Location: Wyoming - USA
Posts: 10,752
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Just looking through threads and saw this. Did you ever get to your ulterior motive?
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My Fanfic: Letters of Firiel Tales of Nolduryon Visitors Come to Court Ñ á ë ?* ó ú é ä ï ö Ö ñ É Þ ð ß ® ™ [Xurl=Xhttp://entmoot.tolkientrail.com/showthread.php?s=&postid=ABCXYZ#postABCXYZ]text[/Xurl] Splitting Threads is SUCH Hard Work!! |
10-31-2016, 12:12 PM | #10 |
Salt Miner
Join Date: Jun 2005
Location: gone to Far Harad
Posts: 987
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I have my ulterior motive all laid out. My hand is injured, though, and typing is a pain. (This is non-dominant hand typing.)
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